Thanks for a clearer explanation on things going on during and the end of the streaming process with PA feature engaged.

Seems to me that PA has added more data crunching complexity to the streaming process (as opposed to non-PA streaming) so much that any interruption like changing volume or applying next/stop require meticulous handling of sample data to make sure nothing will be lost so much that glitches can be generated in an audible frequency band. The compromise is to put those glitches into LF band with minimum amplitude so we don't feel the earth quake!  Wow ! What an art of coding you have done!

Not sure what I understand above  is something in a right direction.

Thanks,
Praphan

Hi Peter,

Thanks for a thorough elaboration.

I developed a habit to measure the LF pulse since I don't like it even though it is not audible. This is because I hate to see large excursion of the woofer diaphragm. I know it is not harmful but this is some kind of "obsession". So what I am looking for is to eliminate the LF plop rather than accentuate it. This is achieved with my low SFS and net buffer setting in z-7-4. The fade out at stop is fast though but at a higher audible frequency,  very mild and felt unharmful to me.

I must admit that I did apply an undecent test on z-7-5 last night. I think what went wrong yesterday was that I tested 7-5 in full OS mode and attended.  I am quite certain that I clicked minimize OS after activating this new version which should reboot the system into MIN mode. But when I booted my audio PC today, it was not. The min OS button was blue. So I had to reboot into min mode. Therefore the 7-5 test last night was conducted under the full OS mode (attended too) which was not decent. Moreover, I used small bookshelf speaker and therefore audible crack was heard at changing digital volume. When I changed the net buffer setting and SFS size, I also gave too high the value.

I conducted a more decent test on z-7-5 again today at your recommended setting NB 14x1x4096 and SFS 60. You are right, no audible tick/crack at changing volume. But instead an inaudible mild LF plop *each and every time* the volume is changed with about 3-4 second delay after the command. Just watch the woofer diaphragm. At stop or next track command is given, larger (than that of changing volume) LF inaudible plop is seen on diaphragm. However, this is at a lesser excursion than what I saw on z7-3 and before.  I think I can leave with this if you insist that LF plop things should be allowed and maintained which indicates that AP is working at its best. Which in turn yielding a better SQ ?

So my bad and switching to 7-5 today.

Thanks and regards,
Praphan

PS : I also noticed that more complicated thing is going on at the end of the playlist when the streaming stop. Not only simple plop but combined with crackkkkinggggg but short though. So what I usually did is hit Alt-S like you, or even turn off the main amps before the end of playlist if I am done with the listening session.

I do.

I owned a number of native hires albums produced by Chesky and Reference Recordings. Those albums are exact copy of their master hires wave files. RR uses 176.4 kHz (4 times that of red book) resolution while Chesky is 192 kHz. Chesky only delivers their hires album to US address.  I also bought the redbook version of those albums too. Example is Rebecca Pidgeon's Raven.

The popular track in Raven that I used to AB test the difference in SQ is "Spanish Harlem". With XXHE's AP and NOS1 USB,  I must admit that the difference in music presentation between the two resolutions is very subtle. With 24/192 playing in native format without up sampling (as compared to 4x AP redbook), I can feel a slightly deeper sense of stage dimension. This can be identified with only critical listening session. However, there seems to be a magic in 4xAP which delivers more musicality presentation than the native hires. Rebecca voice has a richer body blending better with instruments around her and finally give me a better sense of involvement in this piece of music.

Note that I tested this again today with similar view. PA must be off since it produces continuous ticks on hires materials.

To me, well recorded redbook can deliver stunning and excellent music presentation. My reference albums are mostly produced by Winston Ma of FIM (First Impression Music) such as the TBM Sounds which was remastered from 1970's Japanese analog master tape by Grammy award winning mastering engineers. Another reference album that Jim Smith who wrote "Get Better Sound" used extensively in audio show set up is Tears of Stone : The Chieftains. One of the best recordings I ever heard. These are all REDBOOKs.

Best,
Praphan

Hi Peter,

Downloaded and installed z-7-5 then hooked up my voltmeter to measure AC pulse at speaker binding posts as usual.

At low SFS (2) and low net buffer size (15x1x4096) , z-7-5 brought back audible ticks at changing volume and powerful LF plop at stop - the same way as I experienced in pre z-7-4. Increasing SFS and net buffer yield even worse annoying tick and plop.

I will adhere to z-7-4, the version that I can tweak (my XXHE setting, bios setting, device driver choice) to get softest plop at stop (very mild LF pulse). Moreover, mild tick will occur only once at the first click of digital volume change in a particular track. The subsequent change in digital volume in that same track will produce no more tick at all.

Luckily, this low SFS and net buffer size yield a better SQ in my system too.

Kind regards,
Praphan

Hi Peter,

Apart from Berkeley Alpha DAC, I also A/B tested with Benchmark DAC 1 Pre. NOS 1 won in all aspects from the perspective of SQ.

Praphan

Hi Peter and Bert,

Please post photos of your show in the forum.

Thanks,
Praphan

Brian thanks,

As for me the plop at SFS 60 is larger. So I settle at SFS of 2 which results in a more favorable SQ in my system.

Regards,
Praphan

Thanks a lot Brian. No hurry. I still have acceptable plop at stop and changing track. If you don't then I will try to leverage from your experience.

Regards,
Praphan

Hi Peter,

The loop problem is completely solved.

In addition, this version of XXEngine3 does give me a better solution to minimize the PLOP at the stop of the track. It did turn scary PLOP to small plob at the stop or changing track.  However, this can only be achieved with very narrow setting range ie SFS at 2 and only 2 and net buffer of 14(or 15)x1x 4096. Tick by changing digital volume can be indirectly solved by using normalized volume. To minimize tick when changing volume, SFS has to be 60 and this is not good since it will bring back strong PLOP at STOP.

So far so good for me. Thanks so much.

regards,
Praphan

Hi Brian,

As we are in the same league on low SFS and net buffer size, I would appreciate your sharing of experience at the stop of track.

With your current set up, I wonder if you had any inaudible "plob" at the "stop" or "next" of the track at all. You can use DC volt meter to measure this strong LF AC pulse (approx +/- 1 volt depending on digital attenuation level) at the binding posts. Alternatively, watch the excursion of the woofer to see if it traveled so much.

Thanks,
Praphan

Hi Peter,

Since I am also as curious as you, I hooked up my spare bookshelf speaker to my tube amp and check this "loop" phenomenon out. I have developed a habit of checking the DC and LF AC pulse at the hit of stop on all new XX release before feeding the signal to my more expensive speakers.

This LOOP from the stop is related to :

(1) SFS : in my case below 6-8 is already a problem

(2) Rate of AP upsampling : At SFS = 2 and 1xAP (or no upsampling at all), you will have a very short loop. At SFS = 2 and 4xAP, the loop will be a little longer. Then at double octo AP , the loop seems to be forever.

(3) The level of digital attenuation : the louder the digital volume, the longer the loop. At -40 dBFS , 8xAP and SFS of 10,  very short loop.

All other fixed settings are : net buffer size = 4096x14x1, Phasure driver latency of 4 ms, PA - engaged.

I found this loop syndrome in z7-4 (implying low SFS, high volume and high rate of up sampling) to be dangerous to my system. Killing XXEngine 3 to end the loop will follow by strong punchy crack. I tried rebooting my audio PC to see if things will change. And yes after one of the reboots, I encountered the loudest crack ever (with a AC pulse of +/- 1.5v reading) immediately after the first start of the track. This pulse triggered the protection circuitry of my amp and hence cutting the power immediately.    Luckily, I tested this with my bookshelf speaker. 

Switching SFS to 60 seems to bring crack at the start and plop at the stop to be on par with z7-3. One improvement that I found on z7-4 is that *at SFS = 60* the click and/or crack from the change of digital volume is disappeared (no AC pulse on the meter)

Without engaging PA, XXHE behaves nicely. Haven't got a chance to check the SQ though. I have to be comfortable with bookshelf speaker test before connecting my B&W to the amps.

Hope the above helps.
Kind regards,
Praphan

Hi Peter,

Are you looking  for this topic?

http://www.phasure.com/index.php?topic=2170.0

Regards,
Praphan

Hello Juan,

I trust this post finds you well.

If you have a free PCI slot, you may like to try this.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/PCI-USB-PS2-CONTROLLER-CARD/dp/B003TX6932

Hope this should serve your purpose.

Cheers!
Praphan

Hi Peter,

This is about removing WAT (Windows Activation Technology).

Please check this link :
 http://techglobex.blogspot.com/2011/07/make-windows-7-genuine-and-activate-by.html

Hope the above will help.
Regards,
Praphan

Hi Gerard,

Me too. I cannot find the blue led.
Alternatively, please go to the drop down box where you can find and tune Q and Q factor. To the right, there is a box with the word "OFF" inside.  Click that OFF button will kill Engine 3.

I hope I have the right understanding.
Regards,
Praphan