XXHighEnd

Until very recently, I was using a headless music pc (without screen, keyboard and mouse). So I was accessing it through RDC - yes, through networking.

I never gave importance on the VGA cable, since its use was only occasional (when accessing the BIOS). Most of the time it was disconnected.

Finally Peter convinced me to use "Stop All Services", so I connected these devices on the music pc to play music. I stopped using RDC and networking accordingly. I am connected to the TV LCD through a VGA cable I have had for quite some times now.

I was aware that a cable with DVI can be better. I won't go into the different DVI possible connections, but I got a cable with a DVI connection at one end and an HDMI connection at the other.

Then something I have never noticed since I have the NOS1 happened: there is a "glare", some voices seems "edgy". There is also some kind of "sizzle" at times, when the sound seems to saturate due to high recording levels (like in analog recordings)...

I connected the VGA cable and while all seems less prominent, it also seems there. The difference is subtle, but it's better than with the DVI-HDMI cable.

Pushing the experience, I changed the settings to have things like they were before: with networking, with RDC, without keyboard, mouse, nor screen.

In the comparison from worst (with "glare") to best (without "glare"):
1. DVI to HDMI
2. VGA to VGA
3. Through RDC (with networking)

The graphic card is a basic ASUS card with nothing in particular.

Has someone else experienced such results ?

Alain

Hey Alain,

Well, I did not experience that in exactly this fahsion, I have always had the idea that I rather liked by tablet-bluetooth connection (which is through RDC en in the end) over the direct control. All I did though, was switching off the monitor of the audio PC. Nothing special.

Although I don't use the tablet control anymore, I have been switching off the monitor since. Also I think it is directly audible, but it needs a monitor with a more physical switch to perceive that. I mean, the monitor I am currently using is "too electronic" and it always takes a few seconds for it to shut off in even a couple of visible stages.

Then I know that each monitor (as far as I can tell) throws a high frequency of 91KHz on ... not sure, but I think the mains. Anyway, this is visible on the outputs of the DAC and sticks some 15dB out of the noise. This is not the switching PSU of it, but just the monitor itself (and otherwise what it implies to the psu brick, which just stays in the mains). Even the iMac I have here shows the same (this is one monitor with PC built in it).

I have seen more situations (visitors bringing PC + monitor) where all gets fairly wacky in the noise department, just when the monitor is switched on.

These are just examples in the area of things which sure can be completely avoided like working through RDC. So, keyboard and mouse the same because they too have their influence; electrical but also OS wise. Point is though that at least at this moment there is no solution to bringing down the LAN (LAN is needed for RDC) and bringing it up again at your will. So, down is easy, but up - how to do that without LAN. :sleeping:
And the LAN (OS activities) is one of the most devistating "features" for SQ. How this compares to monitor (connection) sh*t ... of course not because all apples and oranges.

So yes, these things have been in my mind for a very long time, but I don't know how to solve it.

Peter

Thanks. I don't understand why this is happening like this. I thought it would be the contrary - the DVI being the better, then the VGA, then the RDC being the worst... But no...

And yes, I see what you mean by the noise.

The only thing I do for RDC is disconnect myself from the music PC as soon as I have pressed PLAY...

Maybe I should send you a file showing that "glare". It's in the singer's voice...

Alain

EDIT: BTW the DVI connector on the cable is a DVI-D (Single Link). Wikipedia has a picture with the 5 different DVI connectors (mine is the third).

I can imagine the DVI (digital) connection maintaining a continuous "handshake". Analog (VGA) is "just there". Both may carry the same noise but the digital adds that continuous data.

It could be the reason yes... Or it could be the power (120V) that also brings its problems... I will try my old Viewsonic (17 inch) screen. It only carries VGA, but maybe it will change something.

Alain

Interesting. Several months ago I switched from VGA to DVI --no HDMI--and the sound improvement regarding glare was significant. Makes me wonder, Alain, if the HDMI connector is the "problem" with your DVi cable?

Hi Brian,

Ah... I did not think about that... I have another monitor with a DVI connection (I think)... I will try it.

Thanks !

Alain

FYI and FWIW :

Although DVI and HDMI are generally accepted as the same, they really are not. And well, this doesn't relate to audio (which for sure is different in the both but which doesn't play a role here) but at the PC side HDMI transfers to movie colors while DVI translates to PC colors. Or maybe this is just at the display's side - I forgot.
This too of course is not really related, but the both connections just are not the same. So have an DVI-HDMI converter (connector) or the other wat around, and you can expect differences. Don't ask me where in our case.

Peter

But I did. :)
One case is already suspicious to me (because I always believe people right away - but can be disproven later) but two ...

But two... ? Did you loose your breath while typing ? ;)

Alain

One case ... but two cases ...
... is really suspicious.

Would ThightVNC (a VNC) be an advantage replacing RDC if you eventually use the LAN OFF and ON ?

Alain

Here's some other observations about vga v DVI from August 9, 2013. I believe it was Nick who posted first about it in the thread:

http://www.phasure.com/index.php?topic=2677.msg27651#msg27651

I read a few things this morning about differences between DVI and HDMI... Earlier DVI connections were not carrying sound, but it is possible now, if the graphic card is set for that...

I am also waiting for Peter to aknowledge if the glare I hear from the singer on a specific song is also present for him. I wonder if this kind of thing could be recorded like that...

Alain

Alain,

A glare as such I don't perceive from it. A strangely (sort of all over fake) processed recording Yes. Couldn't focus to anything. Mono as it feels but which is isn't at all.
Dynamics seem zero.

So maybe you are right and a glare is in there, but to my ears it is so poor that I couldn't even focus on that.

If you have better recorded examples ... happy to try that too. Or propose this one to others, maybe they have better ears.

Regards,
Peter

I had a VGA only screen until recently I unplugged it and plugged in a DVI screen - no real difference.

So then I rebooted and used the DVI screen - clearly an improvement.

I use a DVI screen now. Nick suggested it could be the drivers - possibly / probably anyway I just stick with the DVI now.

For sure worthwhile but nothing compared with the upgrade in SQ the AUDIO GRADE USB 3.0 PCIE CARD provided - totally fundamental.

Cheers

Paul

In my experience there is no perceptible differences among VGA or DVI cables, never tested however the HDMI. I don´t find differences either among to have the VGA/DVI plugged or unplugged (I use a VGA cable with a DVI adpater) nor with the monitor on or off. BUT, just in case, and following the rule that less devices connected should be better I took the habit to turn off the monitor when the music starts to sound.

Juan