XXHighEnd

Ultimate Audio Playback => Your questions about the PC -> DAC route => Topic started by: Gerard on January 14, 2014, 08:20:22 pm



Title: Silverstone card
Post by: Gerard on January 14, 2014, 08:20:22 pm
Does anybody have a link to this card everybody is talking about?

Thanx

 :)


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: juanpmar on January 14, 2014, 08:25:49 pm
Does anybody have a link to this card everybody is talking about?

Thanx

 :)

Hi,

http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=364&area=en (http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=364&area=en)

Regards,
Juan



Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: Gerard on January 14, 2014, 08:29:44 pm
 :good:

Thank you


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: pedal on January 16, 2014, 01:18:13 pm
Because of all the positive feedback from so many users, including Peter himself, I gotta buy and try this soundcard too. At only €25.- the cost is pocket money anyway.

But which version to choose:
SilverStone SST-EC04-E USB 3.0 PCie (1x SATA Power) or
SilverStone SST-EC04-P USB 3.0 PCie (1x 4pin Molex).

-My PC takes both.

Thanks in advance!


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: PeterSt on January 16, 2014, 02:19:17 pm
Hey Pedal,

I think we all have the P version (Molex). Besides that, maybe SATA is worse though it needs investigation of the power supply in the PC to really know that.
But now I think of it, for the Molex would count the same. So :

What seems best is when a spply line is taken from a group in the PSU which doesn't supply other devices as well.
*If* it matters in the first place !

Regards,
Peter


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: Gerard on January 16, 2014, 05:36:24 pm
Hey Pedal,

I think we all have the P version (Molex). Besides that, maybe SATA is worse though it needs investigation of the power supply in the PC to really know that.
But now I think of it, for the Molex would count the same. So :

What seems best is when a spply line is taken from a group in the PSU which doesn't supply other devices as well.
*If* it matters in the first place !

Regards,
Peter

Peter,

Where did you buy?

Thanx


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: PeterSt on January 16, 2014, 06:36:17 pm
Gerard, a distributor. You can't buy there. So, a bit of Googling I guess ?

Peter


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: juanpmar on January 16, 2014, 08:01:20 pm
Gerard, you can buy it here:

- http://www.amazon.co.uk/SilverStone-SST-EC04-P-EC04/dp/B00A0A3GO2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1389898424&sr=8-1&keywords=EC04-P (http://www.amazon.co.uk/SilverStone-SST-EC04-P-EC04/dp/B00A0A3GO2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1389898424&sr=8-1&keywords=EC04-P)

- http://www.amazon.de/Silverstone-SST-EC04-P-SilverStone-Controller-Elektronik/dp/B00A0A3GO2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1389898544&sr=8-1&keywords=EC04-P (http://www.amazon.de/Silverstone-SST-EC04-P-SilverStone-Controller-Elektronik/dp/B00A0A3GO2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1389898544&sr=8-1&keywords=EC04-P)

Or here in Netherland:

WAVE Computers Nederland CV
Handelsweg 110
2988 DC Ridderkerk
Phone:+31 (0) 180 - 54 51 70
Fax:+31 (0) 180 - 54 51 71

Best regards,
Juan



Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: PeterSt on January 16, 2014, 08:07:50 pm
Wave you can't buy. Alternate you can (same as Wave but Wave is the distributor branche - both have the same stock).

Peter

PS: Thank you Juan.


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: CoenP on January 16, 2014, 08:42:58 pm
Gerard,

I ordered mine with Alternate (www.alternate.nl (http://www.alternate.nl)). Superfast delivery. I had it the next day in the mail.

Regards, Coen


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: Gerard on January 16, 2014, 08:47:59 pm
Gerard,

I ordered mine with Alternate (www.alternate.nl (http://www.alternate.nl)).

Regards, Coen

Me too haha.. Made a typo yesterday and could not find.

Thanx.  :)


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: Gerard on January 16, 2014, 09:10:10 pm
And everybody use Molex to power this card? I see 2 connectors on the card.

 :)


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: CoenP on January 16, 2014, 11:05:38 pm
And everybody use Molex to power this card? I see 2 connectors on the card.

 :)

The other connector is for an external USB connector like the ones in your PC's casing. It has the same pinning as the 'PC case' USB connectors on your motherboard.

regards, Coen


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: PeterSt on January 17, 2014, 08:12:06 am
Quote
And everybody use Molex to power this card?

At least the NOS1 won't work without.
Peter


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: Nick on January 17, 2014, 05:46:08 pm
Hi All,

I'm interested in trying a clock change out on the card but it would be good to take a closer look before jumping in. I was looking at the card in low res pictures on-line to try to spot any anything that marks out its implementation from other cards, but the pictures are not very useful.  The crystal and nest of components around it are one of the main areas I of interest because of the crystal implementation's ability to influence the cards audio performance.

Would anyone who has the card be able to post a hi-res picture of the crystal area ?

Many thanks,

Nick.


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: ed linssen on January 17, 2014, 05:59:59 pm
Hi,
I wonder what makes this card so special in the beginning.
I thought it was the using of an IT controller, but in the later writings I see Silverstone using the NEC devices again.
What version are you all talking about?
Ed

   
quote author=Nick link=topic=2844.msg29887#msg29887 date=1389977168]
Hi All,

I'm interested in trying a clock change out on the card but it would be good to take a closer look before jumping in. I was looking at the card in low res pictures on-line to try to spot any anything that marks out its implementation from other cards, but the pictures are not very useful.  The crystal and nest of components around it are one of the main areas I of interest because of the crystal implementation's ability to influence the cards audio performance.

Would anyone who has the card be able to post a hi-res picture of the crystal area ?

Many thanks,

Nick.
[/quote]


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: Nick on January 17, 2014, 07:39:23 pm
Hi,
I wonder what makes this card so special in the beginning.
I thought it was the using of an IT controller, but in the later writings I see Silverstone using the NEC devices again.
What version are you all talking about?
Ed

   
Hi All,

I'm interested in trying a clock change out on the card but it would be good to take a closer look before jumping in. I was looking at the card in low res pictures on-line to try to spot any anything that marks out its implementation from other cards, but the pictures are not very useful.  The crystal and nest of components around it are one of the main areas I of interest because of the crystal implementation's ability to influence the cards audio performance.

Would anyone who has the card be able to post a hi-res picture of the crystal area ?

Many thanks,

Nick.

Ed hi,

See what you mean, the links in the thread show two quite different looking card layouts.

http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=364&area=en

This is possibly the most unusual / interesting to take a look at is anyone has one to hand to post a pic of.

Cheers,

Nick.


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: CoenP on January 17, 2014, 09:05:11 pm
And everybody use Molex to power this card? I see 2 connectors on the card.

 :)

Today I tried to get the siverstone running on (only) 5V lab supply. No card present in the OS.

Actually when I unplug the molex when the card is operating, it stops altogether, contrary to the PPA studio base card, that keeps on running with a slightly different sound.
This must mean that the molex is more than a firm 5V supply for the USB3 bus. The 12V is used or necessary too.

regards, Coen


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: acg on January 17, 2014, 09:30:42 pm
Hi Coen,

I run the Silverstone on only the 5V pins in the Molex.  I have never connected the 12V wires to the plug.

Like you, when the card is running and I unplug the molex the card becomes invisible to the o/s (but I don't have 12V connected at all).  My deduction is that the 5V is used for more than just the 5V for the USB plug.  I think that it might run the oscillator or something else.

Cheers,

Anthony


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: CoenP on January 17, 2014, 09:43:03 pm
Hi Anthony,

Thanks, I dug no further.

When I lost the card by unplugging the molex, I rebooted with the 5V lab supply connected (and 'on'), result: no card present. Next reboot with the PC PSU molex the USB3 card was detected again. Maybe my 5V or GND made a poor connection. I will try again.

The 5V is shurely necessary for something. Maybe for both the bus and the 1.05V...

regards, Coen


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: acg on January 17, 2014, 10:56:19 pm
Hi,
I wonder what makes this card so special in the beginning.
I thought it was the using of an IT controller, but in the later writings I see Silverstone using the NEC devices again.
What version are you all talking about?
Ed

   
Hi All,

I'm interested in trying a clock change out on the card but it would be good to take a closer look before jumping in. I was looking at the card in low res pictures on-line to try to spot any anything that marks out its implementation from other cards, but the pictures are not very useful.  The crystal and nest of components around it are one of the main areas I of interest because of the crystal implementation's ability to influence the cards audio performance.

Would anyone who has the card be able to post a hi-res picture of the crystal area ?

Many thanks,

Nick.

Ed hi,

See what you mean, the links in the thread show two quite different looking card layouts.

http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=364&area=en

This is possibly the most unusual / interesting to take a look at is anyone has one to hand to post a pic of.

Cheers,

Nick.

Hi Nick,

I just sent you an email with the photo of the card.

Cheers,

Anthony


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: Nick on January 18, 2014, 12:26:20 am
Anthony,

Many thanks will take a look,

Best,

Nick.


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: ed linssen on January 18, 2014, 01:10:33 am
Hi Nick,

The two different controllers are:

NEC uPD720201  and
TI TUSB7340, both used in the Silverstone model 4 card.

I wonder which one is used in the "wonder"card? Hahaha!
Maybe somebody can tell me, since I am really curious.
The one from Nec is , together with the 720202/00,  a popular couple used for a few years now. The TI controller has been put in the market medium 2013.
Ed

  
See what you mean, the links in the thread show two quite different looking card layouts.

http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=364&area=en

This is possibly the most unusual / interesting to take a look at is anyone has one to hand to post a pic of.

Cheers,

Nick.
[/quote]


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: PeterSt on January 18, 2014, 11:09:51 am
This seems not so easy ...

See below; Focus on the position of the crystal.

Let's call the first one A. This is the one I have. EC04-P. NEC.
http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=364&area=en

The next one we'll call B. I think this is aways named EC04. TI.
http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=332

Thrid one is C. This is EC04-E. NEC.
SATA Power connector, but again another layout.
http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=439&area=en


The confusing should only be between A and B and I don't think it is much guaranteed which one you'll get when you order either of them. For example, sites which show the card may show the picture of B while the box (with clear plastic) shows that A is in there.

Peter



Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: ed linssen on January 18, 2014, 11:58:32 am
Thank you, Peter,
The one you have, is a NEC, and that is important to know.
That's the one with the halucinating "drug" in it!

I will try thay one,
Ed



This seems not so easy ...

See below; Focus on the position of the crystal.

Let's call the first one A. This is the one I have. EC04-P. NEC.
http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=364&area=en

The next one we'll call B. I think this is aways named EC04. TI.
http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=332

Thrid one is C. This is EC04-E. NEC.
SATA Power connector, but again another layout.
http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=439&area=en


The confusing should only be between A and B and I don't think it is much guaranteed which one you'll get when you order either of them. For example, sites which show the card may show the picture of B while the box (with clear plastic) shows that A is in there.

Peter




Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: acg on January 18, 2014, 12:18:30 pm
That TI USB Host Controller is very interesting because it is designed to take a 48MHz clock as standard, although it can take any frequency up to 50MHz.  The NEC chips can only take 24MHz crystals (although a clock can be used) which could be important considering these chips all 'clock-up' to 480MHz.  The TI can do this with half the frequency change to the NEC.

You will see that the crystal used on the Silverstone board (in Peters photos above) whith the TI chip is in fact a 48MHz.

Possibly important.  Peter (or anyone else for that matter), if you have one of these boards with the TI chip lying around I would be most interested to hear your impressions compared to the Silverstone with the NEC chip.

Cheers,

Anthony


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: Nick on January 18, 2014, 01:11:42 pm
I had a read through the TI TUSB7340 data sheet earlier, there's some interesting stuff which could be relevant to the sound quality the chip produces:

  • It can be clocked from 20 to 48mhz. There is a pin select on the chip to allow for 48mhz operation without programming. A Rom or PCIe channel programming of a clock multiplier can be used to allow other clock speeds such as 24mhz etc.

  • The chip is specificly designed to used with either a crystal oscillator OR an external clock (similar to what some are doing with external clocks). This is interesting has, someone realised that performance of USB links depends on clock quality or might this be to support synchronous operation with other devices ?

  • The crystal occilator circuit is referenced back to a special pin on the chip where normally the circuit is referenced to the signal ground of the PCB. This could be very important, from clock experiments I'm sure ground noise in the clock signal has a [-ve] effect on sound quality.

  • The clock input pin needs is 1.8v clock signal IIRC what it said in the datasheet. The data sheet specifically states that the input is NOT 3.3v tollerent so clocking with a dexa or any other 3.3v clock source will need some components to step down the clock amplitude.

  • The chip has some high quality PPL implementation, not sure where but in the right place could be very good news for sound quality.

  • Finally there is a spread spectrum feature which is potentially not so positive. I have not got to the bottom of wheather this is enabled all the time or has to be turned on. Personally off would be the place to be for audio.

    Edit actually thinking about this it may be a feature that allows the chip to be tolerant to the PC using spread spectrum. I'll take another look at the data sheet.

The sound of earlier TI usb 2 and usb 3 chipsets were not good IMHO. this new chipset look like a REALLY interesting chipset for audio though. I'm starting to get a sense of why Peters reports on sound quality are so much different from NEC chipset USB cards.

Need to take a listen to this card but its going to be the TI chipset version that for sure.

Nick.


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: Nick on January 18, 2014, 01:35:38 pm
I should have read the post more carefully ! I had not noticed from the above Peter that you have the NEC version.

It might be fun to try the TI version still but NEC copy of the card first to try out :-)

Nick.



Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: PeterSt on January 18, 2014, 03:48:17 pm
Haha Nick; I already didn't understand which direction you were heading ...

Peter


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: Gerard on January 18, 2014, 04:14:22 pm
OK i have two cards now in my pc. One (the old) is a Conrad USB 3 card.
http://www.conrad.nl/ce/nl/product/973583/?insert=89&insertNoDeeplink&productname=2-poorts-USB-30-PCI-express-controller
And the second is the new Silverstone. http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=364&area=en

I like to say that I tried the Conrad card without bracket. But that result in strange reaction from XXhighend and some small ticks/plops.  :(

The Silvertsone does not give that result so i am happy. But the sound is real special. Playing some live recorded music and  you can hear the audience so well. It is if the background has become much more forward.

:-)


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: Gerard on January 18, 2014, 04:24:51 pm
OK i have two cards now in my pc. One (the old) is a Conrad USB 3 card. And the second is the new Silverstone. http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=364&area=en

I like to say that I tried the Conrad card without bracket. But that result in strange reaction from XXhighend and some small ticks/plops.  :(

The Silvertsone does not give that result so i am happy. But the sound is real special. Playing some live recorded music and  you can hear the audience so well. It is if the background has become much more forward.

:-)

I see now that this card (Conrad) has a sata connection also. It alway's worked nut i now wonder if that had to be connected aswel.


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: Stanray on January 20, 2014, 01:52:18 pm
I don’t want to spoil the party, but I feel I have to share my experiences.
 
After listening to the Silverstone card for over a week now, first with and later without the bracket I rejected the card and prefer the mobo USB 3 connection.

From the start I heard little difference between the mobo USB 3 and the Silverstone card. The Silverstone shows a sound-stage that is a kind of “asymmetrical”.
I don’t know how to describe this otherwise , but the sound-stage appears shifted a bit to the left hand side and therefore to be less focused and less deep.
After prolonged listening this becomes irritating, in the sense that I got a feeling that there’s something wrong with my ears. With the mobo usb 3 connection the sound-stage snaps into place.

I have no clue what the explanation is for my different experience with the Silverstone card. :dntknw:

Regards,
Stanley
 


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: PeterSt on January 20, 2014, 03:36:03 pm
Hey Stanley,

Wait until you hear what I have to say next ...
:)
Peter


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: PeterSt on January 20, 2014, 04:02:11 pm
So ...

Re: USB to PC chassis ground ? (noise) - The biggest change ever ! (http://www.phasure.com/index.php?topic=2838.msg29941#msg29941)

Peter


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: Robert on November 10, 2015, 07:39:09 am
Well I just added the insulated Silverstone USB3 card finally and wow what a difference. Sorry no NOS Dac yet but still a very worthwhile upgrade. Tried Spotify first and that was an improvement. More of everything musically. I've still got other things connected to the computer USB wise.

Robert


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: PeterSt on November 10, 2015, 08:31:40 am
:)

Robert, did you buy that only "yesterday" ? People might be interested where to get it.
And if so, what exactly is the type you obtained ?

Thank you,
Peter


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: Robert on November 10, 2015, 09:44:49 am
Yes, yesterday its the one you all have, EC04-P with the Molex power input. Bought online in NZ for $56NZ at Elive Ltd.

I did insulate it from the mainframe even though I have the Benchmark not the NOS.

Personally I think that earth circuits are troublesome and need more work for Hifi.


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: juanpmar on November 10, 2015, 12:25:19 pm
The EC04-P card can be found on Amazon Spain http://www.amazon.es/gp/product/B00A0A3GO2?keywords=Silverstone%20SST-EC04-P&qid=1447175211&ref_=sr_1_1&sr=8-1 (http://www.amazon.es/gp/product/B00A0A3GO2?keywords=Silverstone%20SST-EC04-P&qid=1447175211&ref_=sr_1_1&sr=8-1)

And in all these other places
http://www.amazon.es/gp/offer-listing/B00A0A3GO2/ref=dp_olp_new?ie=UTF8&condition=new (http://www.amazon.es/gp/offer-listing/B00A0A3GO2/ref=dp_olp_new?ie=UTF8&condition=new)

Also in other Amazon stores from other countries like UK or Germany.

Regards,
Juan


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: PeterSt on November 10, 2015, 01:31:25 pm
So it is still in production after all.
OK, good.

Thank you guys !
Peter


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: boleary on December 03, 2015, 02:32:35 pm
 Finally got around to installing an isolated Silverstone card yesterday. I was motivated by Peter's recent comments about the MB usb3 connection sounding dull compared to Silverstone. Several years ago I threw out the Renesis card I had been using in favor of the MB connection because the sound was so much better, less noisy and more natural sounding, with the MB connection. After installing the Silverstone card yesterday I did not have to install the driver on the small disk that came with the Silverstone; rather the PC automatically used some native windows driver or maybe the Renesias driver that I never uninstalled. Anyway, my question is should I use the driver that came with the card? 

Out of the box it sounds pretty good, cymbals shimmer even more, but am letting it burn in a few days before doing serious listening. Eva Cassidy's voice decides all.  :)


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: PeterSt on December 03, 2015, 03:36:57 pm
Brian,

For all the W10 installs I never did anything with a Silverstone Driver.
I guess for my W8 ever back I did. But for the W8 on the "OS-RAM Disk" I also did nothing.

I considered it, but did not really bother (it is so much work to begin with, all this nice "RAM" stuff ;)).

Regards,
Peter


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: boleary on December 03, 2015, 03:45:26 pm
Thanks Peter, l was hoping lwouldn't need to install the driver!


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: Telstar on February 10, 2018, 07:39:13 pm
I suppose any usb3 card is better than onboard usb2.
So for 30€ i could bit the bullet and get this one. It shouldn't harm in my current setup.


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: PeterSt on February 11, 2018, 09:13:08 am
Telstar, if you only don't forget to compare with the MoBo USB. For me, the Silverstone has a character which usually was fine, but not on 14393.0. Whether better than USB2, I simply don't know !

Maybe others ever compared.

Regards,
Peter


Title: Re: Silverstone card
Post by: Telstar on February 11, 2018, 02:27:41 pm
Telstar, if you only don't forget to compare with the MoBo USB. For me, the Silverstone has a character which usually was fine, but not on 14393.0. Whether better than USB2, I simply don't know !

Maybe others ever compared.

Regards,
Peter

Oh, ok.
Then I think i'll just try with a spare usb3 card I have laying around and compare with motherboard usb2.
Theoretically a usb3 port is better and it wouldn't be shared with the usb2 (I have a usb keyboard/mouse).

I have to compare one thing at a time, within the same OS, otherwise is a moot point. :)