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Author Topic: 09-y8  (Read 17253 times)
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Marcin_gps
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« on: March 08, 2010, 04:54:49 pm »

I've just installed it. Frankly, to my ears Special mode plays the best. The sound is coherent - most detailed but without any harshness. Could it be any better than this, Peter? How deep would it go into a record? Right now I am able to hear so much background noises, that I'm actually scared. Is it still music that I am listening to or rather some kind of freaking analysis...
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PeterSt
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« Reply #1 on: March 08, 2010, 05:46:17 pm »

Haha, you may recall my topic from a few days back about re-enstating Anti Imaging upsampling (filtering) and how it again occurred to me how black the background was. And this is a virtue, I have learned. Until I after a few days went back to KS and (in my case) Adaptive Mode, and I really didn't know what I was hearing for background noises. So, or our "black" never has been the good idea, or back then this was about different noise which doesn't belong there.

There was a time that brushes were pereceived as strange noises, if you could hear them at all. Right now they blast through the room.
Have things changed, or have they ...

Day before yesterday I really was in a state of once again posting about that it couldn't be better because I'm perceiving plain reality.
I didn't post it because I have learned that there will always be some new idea to improve, and I guess it never stops. Well, I hope it doesn't or otherwise the fun will be gone.
In any case, I am not done with KS yet. There are more possibilities ...

Thanks,
Peter
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For the Stealth LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - November 13, 2017 (2.09)
XXHighEnd Mach II Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon E5 2640v4 with Hyperthreading On (20 cores) @~720MHz, 32GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = *30*/-/*1*/*1*/*1*/ Q1Factor = *40* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *15ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *0.90*  (max 120) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / *OSD Off* / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = 43 / Nervous Rate = 100 / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 0 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / *Custom Filtering Highest for 705600* / Always Clear Proxy before Playbck = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (*8ms*) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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Marcin_gps
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« Reply #2 on: March 08, 2010, 09:53:09 pm »

I've been comparing Adaptive and Special mode. There is no doubt - Special Mode is superior! In adaptive it's impossible to hear details which are perfectly "visible" in Special mode. Especially when it comes to background details
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PeterSt
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« Reply #3 on: March 09, 2010, 10:18:40 am »

Allright, so maybe it's time for me to switch back to that one again. Pfff
Happy
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For the Stealth LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - November 13, 2017 (2.09)
XXHighEnd Mach II Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon E5 2640v4 with Hyperthreading On (20 cores) @~720MHz, 32GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = *30*/-/*1*/*1*/*1*/ Q1Factor = *40* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *15ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *0.90*  (max 120) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / *OSD Off* / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = 43 / Nervous Rate = 100 / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 0 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / *Custom Filtering Highest for 705600* / Always Clear Proxy before Playbck = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (*8ms*) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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Suteetat
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« Reply #4 on: March 09, 2010, 02:17:43 pm »

I also prefer special mode over adaptive mode. In my system, adaptive mode is leaner and may be a touch cleaner but through special mode, I hear more bloom, string instrument has nicer decay and richer sound. However, in 09y-7 version, I can set Q1 as low as -4 and increase in increment of 1. IN 09y-8 version in special mode, the lowest Q1 setting available was 7 then it go up to 15, 45 etc. In adaptive mode, Q1 go down to 0 with iincrement interval of 1. Also at Q1 of 7 in 097-08, I get a bit of tick and pop but under 09y-7, I am at Q1 level of 0 with no problem so far.
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0.9z-4, KS-adaptive, buffer 256, Q1=1, no oversampling, SFS 100, straight contiguous,
minimum Clock Resolution, Scheme 2
Marcin_gps
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« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2010, 05:20:41 pm »

I switched to 09-y7 and I have to admit that special mode on y7 is better for me, more analogue.
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fzman
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« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2010, 06:01:49 pm »

Although I am running y7 on xp, I think that the phrase "black background" can mean either of two things - one good, the other bad!

With a natural sounding recording, you can hear the spaces between the musicians - that is the acoustic of the space is part of the soundstage along with the musicians-- when you hear only the musicians with nothing between them, then a black background is actually missing ambient and low level information

when the black background means that there are no artifacts or distortion, then it is good!

best,

mark
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xp sp-2, on gigabyte g31 mobo, 1 gig kingston ram, e7200 cpu, with bios settings per cics.  asus essence stx soundcard, powered by my 12v/5v linear power supply (recipe from John Swenson's fit-pc psu design on audio asylum), feeding aq digital cable to cary xciter dac.  0.9y-7 current settings: ks-adaptive, unattended, q1=4, Q2-5 all 0.  player priority nothing, thread priority realtime, services suspended, have not tried any upsampling, or any other modes.
bfromson
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« Reply #7 on: March 09, 2010, 09:57:50 pm »

Just installed .9y-08 Using special mode sound quality is best I have ever heard from my system. Clean and detailed almost beyond belief.

Thank you for a stunningly good product.
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shuttle sn78h7 ssd drive , win 7 32 bit, music on e-sata external-> xxhe 9y-5, ks -> firewire -> weiss DAC2 -> naim 552 -> atc 100 anniversary
PeterSt
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« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2010, 10:03:28 pm »

Thanks ... Very nice to hear !

Welcome !
Happy
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For the Stealth LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - November 13, 2017 (2.09)
XXHighEnd Mach II Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon E5 2640v4 with Hyperthreading On (20 cores) @~720MHz, 32GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = *30*/-/*1*/*1*/*1*/ Q1Factor = *40* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *15ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *0.90*  (max 120) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / *OSD Off* / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = 43 / Nervous Rate = 100 / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 0 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / *Custom Filtering Highest for 705600* / Always Clear Proxy before Playbck = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (*8ms*) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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Telstar
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« Reply #9 on: March 11, 2010, 01:49:38 pm »

I finally did some quiet listening of y-8. I found out that KS/adaptive mode with Q1=1 and buffers 1024 sounds the best that my system ever has.

1024 latency is the minimum for me to not hear distorion or "too many buffer errors". While with Q1=4 i could go as low as 256, the above combination sounds BETTER, more foot-tapping. I lowered Q1 after looking at Peter last signature Wink I generally agree with him about what sounds best.

I have to say that the new PSU could be somewhat related to this, but I surely am not putting back the old psu Wink

Will experiment comparing adaptive to special mode with the above settings.
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(Feb 08 2013)
Software: Windows 7 Home Premium x64 | XXHE 09z-8e | KS | Q=1/0/0/0/0 Unattended | Peak-ext, AP Octal | SFS 2 contiguous | 4096k buffer (need to play with XT!)
Hardware: OrigenAE H5 case | E5300 fanless | Winmate DC-DC fanless PSU | OCZ Vertex SSD |
ATM with headphones: Amanero usb | dac19dsp | CK2III headamp (with Rohm output devices) | ATH-W1000X
Tony S
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« Reply #10 on: March 13, 2010, 02:30:53 am »

Enjoying 09-y8! Took awhile to find the ideal settings but well worth it. I am hearing more information off recordings than I thought was possible. Arc Prediction more detailed than Anti-image but the Anti-Image is a bit warmer and fuller sounding which I prefer for the few tracks I heard. I think I'll be going back and forth between the two settings depending on the music material. The y-8 version is the most stable with my laptop so far and no error messages.

Here are the settings that work best for me without the slo-mo static.

Quad Sampling, Anti-Image, Special Mode, Buffer-1024, Q1-1143 and 15/15/0/0.

Double Sampling same settings as above except Q1-661.

Great work again Peter!

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Vista Basic, Usb ->Musiland Monitor 02 -> Parasound Amp ->2.5 way Vifa/Scanspeak.
Ver. 0.9z-2, Playerprio-Low, Threadprio-Realtime, Buffer 256, 2x Upsampling, Adaptive Mode, Arc Prediction, Scheme-3, Q1- 1/10/10/0/0, SFS 70, Unattended, Services Off.
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« Reply #11 on: March 13, 2010, 03:54:26 pm »

Adaptive or Special Mode? Boy would I like to have more problems like this; they're both fantastic. I do think, for the moment, I'm tending more toward adaptive, where it seems one is several steps closer to the stage. Adaptive is a cleaner, less "warm" sound but I seem to hear more of the detail and richness of Eva's voice in Fields of Gold. And the cleaner sound is not harsh, just more "present". Two days ago, using my M-Audio Audiophile usb for usb/spdif conversion, I know I would have found adaptive mode too harsh or too digital sounding. Not so today. I highly recommend the Hiface if you are on a budget.
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XX2.07/MB: ASRock Extreme 4M , i7-3930K @ 0.5GHz/ RAM-OS W10586/32 Gigs 1600 DDR3/ Lush usb cable  /Q1,3,4,5 = *26*/1/1/*1* / *Q1Factor = 10* / Peak Extension: Off/Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *.5ms* / Straight Contiguous / SFS = *.02,/ Do Nothing With Cover Art / not Invert / *(Phase Alignment Off  / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Real Time / Scheme = 3-5 / UnAttended (Just Start) / *All* Services Off except LAN & RDC/ Persist off/No OSD / No Running Time / Minimize OS / Boost on/XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 100 / Cool when Idle = NA / Provide Stable Power = 0 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Best/ Time Stability = On/ No Up-sampling/R-2R DAC
ivo
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« Reply #12 on: March 15, 2010, 12:07:52 am »

Possibly I can take here THE first prize Happy

Tonight spent time comparing Adaptive vs Special modes in double Anti-image mode (16/44 -->24/96). Cannot use ArcPred as my USB unit accepts only 48 and 96 kHz. (Still waiting for my HiFace and hope it will beat my current situation). So, let's get started!

adaptive:
q1=2, buffer=128, cpu~5% Happy
sound Happy

special:
q1=1(2 in samples), buffer=128, cpu~20-25% unhappy as it makes fans spin which create noise
sound HappyHappyHappy

So, I choose special mode and try not to listen to the noise.


Other appropriate settings(common): Scheme-3/Low/Realtime.

So, Peter, can you give me more? Happy Meaning, can we go below 2 samples???

BTW, it seems to me, not sure yet, but on my OS DAC Anti-image probably goes better than ArcPred...?
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Music on internal HDD in FLAC-->LatestXX in QAP + PeakExt Mode[KS,Adaptive,2048,Q1=14,xQ1=1,Sch3,Low,Realtime,15 ms, SFS 2-400, Straight, stop all, MinOS]-->Windows 7 Pro SP1 x64bit-->Intel i5 based laptop [8 GB RAM]-->JKDAC32(HiFace based USB-I2S-DAC)-->Denon PMA-1500AE-->JBL E90 3-way speakers
ivo
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« Reply #13 on: March 15, 2010, 12:08:07 pm »

OK, yesterday when I wrote previous post I was judging about sound via wireless headphones - good ones, the regular way I listen to the music. This morning played several albums via speakers and can confirm that to me SPECIAL mode sounds better than ADAPTIVE. It is more warm, more detailed, very crisp and clear and the sound stage is very 3-D. So far it is best coming out from XX via my speakers, will see how it plays with ArcPred when my HiFace arrives.
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Music on internal HDD in FLAC-->LatestXX in QAP + PeakExt Mode[KS,Adaptive,2048,Q1=14,xQ1=1,Sch3,Low,Realtime,15 ms, SFS 2-400, Straight, stop all, MinOS]-->Windows 7 Pro SP1 x64bit-->Intel i5 based laptop [8 GB RAM]-->JKDAC32(HiFace based USB-I2S-DAC)-->Denon PMA-1500AE-->JBL E90 3-way speakers
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« Reply #14 on: March 15, 2010, 01:30:29 pm »

Ivo, can you try Engine 3 and let us know how that compares to Special Mode?
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