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Author Topic: Etn^2 squared?  (Read 1157 times)
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CoenP
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« on: October 25, 2018, 04:31:55 pm »

While the 360 revolution is upon us I noticed an absence of attention towards the “unimportant” ethernet connection between music server and player.

Now this cable may not carry a lot or any signal while playing, it is a medium that can pick up and conduct undesirable electromagnetic signals. Hence my conjecture that the benefits or effects of the 360 shielding trick might very well apply to the ethernet cables as well.

I do not have the stuff or time to pull such an experiment off. Has anyone done experiments with different ethernet cables and or shielding (like connecting an SFTP shield one way only)?

Cheers, Coen
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Settings: Qn: , SFS: , timeres: XT tweaks: , buf: 4096, driver: 8 ms,

Audio PC (jan 19): XXHE PC v1 with RAMdisk w.o. videocard and 1 of 2 cpu fans + BRIX/USB3 storage musicserver. ETN to Fibre converters (linear supplies), 500m SFP modules & 5m OM4 cable. Power cable PE not connected, together with nos1 and poweramp in separate "audio" powerstrip.

Clarixa set + Intona (or Lush 1m), Phasure NOS1a-75B G3 USB (buf 16 ms)-> Blaxius ->SE EL95 (0,8W triode) + cheap link to Abaqus 300W plateamps> Bastanis cable-> Bastanis Sagarmatha Duo ("DIY").

[other sources: TD124/3009SII-i/Grace F9/lounge LCR phono; Rega Planet 1997 vintage]
PeterSt
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« Reply #1 on: October 25, 2018, 05:45:30 pm »

Hi Coen,

The only experience I have is that the Ethist^2 can most probably be ordered from of tomorrow because then we will have a picture for the webshop.
Otherwise it is that today we all had a day off or else it would have been ready right now.
Price can be thought of the same as for the Lush^2 for the shorter lengths; at which lengths it will be available depends a bit on how things work out tomorrow but hopefully long also and then at not crazy prices.

Over here (Phasure) we do not have any experience with it and the Ethist^2 has been made because people request it. A bit of the same as how it went with Blaxius^2 and in the end for sure also how Lush^2 emerged; I reject a couple of times until I start to see that maybe things may work.
So an Ethernet cable ? be my guest ! Happy

Regards,
Peter
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For the Stealth III LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - Oct 31, 2018 (2.10)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 10/20 cores) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 30/-/1/1/1/ Q1Factor = 10 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 15ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 140.19  (max 140.19) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = 35 / Nervous Rate = 10 / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 0 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / *Arc Prediction Filtering (16x)* / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^2*A:B-W-Y-R, B:B-W-R* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> *Blaxius^2 A:B-R, B:B-R* Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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PeterSt
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« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2018, 06:25:13 pm »


OK, that was easy. swoon
Anyway, a first is already at her owner by now and it is not me. Happy

High Resolution link

From Ethist^2 via Ethernist^2, we named her ET^2. More tentacles than ever.

So no, it was not so easy at all. This is because when we apply shielding as such, the shielding must also try to be effective. And this does not happen much by wrapping a screen around a able (and an other and an other).

The above can be combined with the sheer fact that Ethernet (or the cable, never mind it is used for Ethernet or is "abused" for outboard i2s connection) officially does not carry a shield which connects to the (plastic) connectors and from there to the device chassis. But this one now does !
So technically we made it a completely different beast.

The white (cotton sleeved wires) you see in the photo are the "end to end" connections for the chassis grounding. Thus, envision that the eyes / washers at the end are screwed to the chassis of e.g. a network streaming device for the A (source) side of the cable. And the other (B) end is connected to ...
Nothing !
We feel that a shield to be effective it should be (or can be) connected to one side (device) only. But is it then not allowed to connect it to both devices ?

That depends ...

If the connection is to provide an Ethernet connection, then it shouldn't connect the two devices in involved, because Ethernet is inherently galvanically isolating. This is for a reason of course, so I'd respect that.

If the connection is meant for i2s, then the application normally requires device to device grounding connection. But wait, this is ground, which is not per sé the chassis. This depends really on what the manufacturers wanted to make of that (but my own idea of : not much thought of, but alas). Now when you'd formally connect the devices by this extra wire (which is what you could always have done) then at least what you prevent is the current of the two devices (ground) potential difference flowing over the data wires (the ground return wires of them).
Aha ...
And meanwhile, that connection is shielding, just like USB was designed. But also : like with USB it is perfectly allowed to connect the screen/shield to one side (device) only; the shielding will be as effective, but in a different fashion (which, as we now now by definitely sure, makes a quite outrageous audible difference - see the Lush^2).

And so the ET^2 is almost more vigorous than the Lush^2; It undoubtedly improves the connection as such because it adds a dimension. And, if you use the ET^2 for normal Ethernet, then nothing wil break really if you use the ground connection at both ends. It is only that Ethernet was not designed for that, and that by guarantee you will break the galvanic isolation Ethernet had in mind.

So all is up to you.

Of course you understood that the Black wire(s) which normally connect to the ground in - or chassis of the connector(s), now connect to the cotton-sleeved ground wires. Thus, it would be perfectly allowed to connect each of these wires to the respective devices, but decide later which to connect for real by means of applying the respective Black wire to the bridge connector (the connector with the red dot you see in the photo(s)). And of course you again caught that the shield (or shields) to use for the device-device (half) connection, is completely up to you.

High Resolution link

While those connection-eyes are for the mere permanent connection, in the package you will also find a pair of crocodile wires so you can more easily test what works best for you. Just connect to an eye on one end of the crocodile wire and the other end somewhere to the device.
But there's a pitfall : The cotton-sleeved ground wires itself are shielded ! This means that the crocodile wires - which are not shielded - may deteriorate an otherwise good ground connection (it may catch radiation (RFI) easier). So always expect a technical (and with that possibly audible) difference when you tested with a crocodile wire and later make it permanent but screwing the eye to some part of the device.

Questions ? don't hesitate.
Peter

PS: For extra fun and possibilities, it would be allowed to connect the ground wires to themselves (and not to a device at all). Of course you could try all the various internal shield connections with it !  boemmy
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For the Stealth III LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - Oct 31, 2018 (2.10)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 10/20 cores) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 30/-/1/1/1/ Q1Factor = 10 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 15ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 140.19  (max 140.19) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = 35 / Nervous Rate = 10 / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 0 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / *Arc Prediction Filtering (16x)* / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^2*A:B-W-Y-R, B:B-W-R* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> *Blaxius^2 A:B-R, B:B-R* Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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Michael_B
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« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2019, 03:16:49 pm »

I've been an early adopter of the Lush^2 and Blaxius^2. Both cables have had a significant positive impact on the SQ in my system.

However I haven't pulled the trigger on the ET^2 yet. Although this cable has been available since October 2018 I haven't seen (found) any comment about it. I would appreciate to read some feedback on this cable from actual users (if any?) or Peter himself.

In my system the ET^2 would be used for ethernet purpose.

Thanks,

Michael
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XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 16/32 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 10/20 cores) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 30/-/1/1/1/ Q1Factor = 10 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 15ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 4.02  (max 4.02) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Persist Yes / WallPaper Off / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = 38 / Nervous Rate = 10 / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 0 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / *Arc Prediction Filtering (16x)* / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On / USB3 port #4 -> Lush ->Icron USB LAN Extender LEX -> UTP Cat 6 -> Icron REX ->  Lush^2*A:B-W-Y-R, B:B-W-R* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> *Blaxius^2 A:B-R, B:B-R* Interlink -> AVM SA8 -> LEEDH E2 Speakers + Blaxius -> LEEDH SUB 20.1
AC Power: 3 x Dedicated lines for: Amp., PC + DAC and Sub / 2 x Topaz Ultra Isolation transformers 1.8kva (ea) (0.0005pf) for the NOS1a and Amp.
Music on USB Stick inserted in Icron REX module.
Others: Uptone LPS-1 for ICRON USB Extender 2304GE-USB LAN Extender / TP-Link MC200CM Fiber Media Converter / SOTM ISO Cat6 Ethernet filter.
PeterSt
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« Reply #4 on: April 14, 2019, 04:09:15 am »

Hi Michael and all of you,

It would be correct that nothing much is to be found about the ET^2. The main reason would be that it is not promoted by me at this time because I am not using it myself. BUT :

The ET^2 was explicitly made for i2s connections which would be a reason why you can't here much from me as well as from 99% of other people, which leaves a hand full of people who could write about it but who may never will because not everybody writes on a forum (or this one). And then also : i2s would be so special and so dedicated to the DAC in question, that it would be quite useless to express about it. And lastly these DACs are most often from China origin and the cable is therewith sold to people in China (mostly Hong Kong, hopefully not offending anyone) which is a group within itself.

BUT then again : The ET^2 obviously can be used for LAN connection just the same and if 4 are sold for that reason I may be exaggerating 1 already hence no data there (yet) but what I *do* have for data is very positive. And that application I should be able to use myself (I'd say between Mach III and Music Server PC).

Small point could also be that promoting the ET^2 may make us crazy  a bit because there's no day any more without work on the other cables and once it gets known that it really works out (which by know I believe in advance) there may be an unnatural queue for about everything.

Anyway, yesterday I politely asked whether a small possibility might exist that I myself would receive one but which would be of inordinate length (I need a connection from the living room to the basement somewhere (how familiar Happy) and am stil waiting for my Lush^2 requiring the same route for the HTPC connection to the NOS1a which requires the same length. Each will be a day of work and so I am waiting  forever to be serviced. Yeah, poor me.

Meanwhile you have ordered one, so let's agree that you could be a first to express about it.

Kind regards,
Peter
Logged

For the Stealth III LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - Oct 31, 2018 (2.10)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 10/20 cores) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 30/-/1/1/1/ Q1Factor = 10 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 15ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 140.19  (max 140.19) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = 35 / Nervous Rate = 10 / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 0 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / *Arc Prediction Filtering (16x)* / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^2*A:B-W-Y-R, B:B-W-R* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> *Blaxius^2 A:B-R, B:B-R* Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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