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Author Topic: World's first NOS 24/384 filterless DAC  (Read 500846 times)
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pedal
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« Reply #75 on: January 13, 2009, 02:37:13 pm »

What I didn't tell so far, is that nearly all preparations have been taken in order to produce this DAC and sell it. Yep, and in its own dedicated "Phasure NOS1" cabinet.
Wow. Breaking news! Do you have any estimated price? (At least, can you give an indication?).
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« Reply #76 on: January 13, 2009, 03:23:31 pm »

Yes ...

For those who already knew (offline), what I calculated so far was 3450 euro ex (if applicable) vat and shipping. However, this anticipated on an onboard Firewire connection which now is to be replaced with the "secret" never done before other connection. This is more expensive (in fact just additional), and although I know what the kind of maximum is, theories tell me that there is a low boundary of 350-450 euro. But :

At this moment I can't tell whether it really will make THE difference because it cannot be tested in NOS mode (read : I won't construct a first version of it, not knowing yet whether it can be used or not).

Peter
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W10-14393.0 - July 17, 2021 (2.11)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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« Reply #77 on: January 13, 2009, 05:15:16 pm »

Yes ...

For those who already knew (offline), what I calculated so far was 3450 euro ex (if applicable) vat and shipping. However, this anticipated on an onboard Firewire connection which now is to be replaced with the "secret" never done before other connection. This is more expensive (in fact just additional), and although I know what the kind of maximum is, theories tell me that there is a low boundary of 350-450 euro. But :

At this moment I can't tell whether it really will make THE difference because it cannot be tested in NOS mode (read : I won't construct a first version of it, not knowing yet whether it can be used or not).

Peter



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Hahaha..... I think i am going to work some extra hours from now on.....

And offcourse a special candlelight diner with my wife!!! rofl rofl
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16GB, *Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0* *from RAM*, music on music server / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *0.10*  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core *3-5* / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive *none* (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Not the best (OS from RAM issue) / Time Stability = Off (OS from RAM issue) / Custom Filter Mid 705600 / -> USB3 (Silverstone both sides isolated = Sw#3 of NOS1a = Up) -> *Clairixa USB 15cm* -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 0.70m -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink ->> Metrum Amps ->> Metrum Acoustics ESL Open Baffle.
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« Reply #78 on: January 14, 2009, 10:43:31 am »

Quote
The DAC board wasn't explicitly designed for NOS mode, and although everything looked good so far, this is where the tweaking stops.

Hahaha, not quite ...
Three rather important things "happened" :

1.
Yesterday I thought "well, if the thing wants I2S only at high sample rate mode (which is what it comes down to), I'll give it that".
And thus, from within XXHighEnd I could use the Quattro mode (for 44.1 files).

2.
While initially the above had been in my mind the whole day yesterday, and I was wondering whether upsampling from the software would workout better than the upsampling by the SRC chip, at attemping this means of playback it sprung to my mind that I ever developed "just Quattro" mode, meaning a higher sample rate only, and no upsampling. Hahaha, that would do the trick !
Note : this means that all the squares from the earlier scope picture just would stay like that, and each sample is just fed 4 times without adjustment (this was back then made for better jitter rejection).

3.
Playing for 1 minute with immediate good result (at 176400) a next thing sprung to my mind, not thinking it would work, but hoping for it ...
The means of source secret I use for the I2S connection is quite different from usual (no Fireface in between), and I notched down the buffer of that means. Note : for 176400 via the Fireface a sample buffer of 128 had to be used (96 or less would not work), which btw is 128 + 64 in real life (the 64 is always there, and is called a Safety Buffer). Now ... I notched down and down and ended up at 48.
Hahaha, so with I2S I now can use the 48 sample buffer for all resolutions ! This is very important because the size of that buffer changes SQ (for SPDIF it does anyway), so the apples and organges thing is out of my life forever ! Only now lowres files can really be compared to hires files !

How does it sound ? (said the reviewer Happy)

Well, first of all the bird is fully alive now !! But wow, what a different sound once again !
I must again emphasize on "sweet"; Sweetness is what can be heard all over, but the combination with other phenomena is strange :

Now the crispyness is still there. Ok, hard to explain, but as it appears now the sweetness I heard from I2S at OS mode indeed is a property by itself (as I expected). Thus, while OS mode removes the cryspiness and the lively sound, this is back now, but the sweet touch of everything smelling like Sses is still there. Cymbals did not loose there metal (which added "sweetness" would incur for), and all squariness from the NOS DAC is nicely there.

Before I continue I want to make clear somehow how huuuge the difference is with SPDIF. In fact this is just two complete different DACs now. The both connections cannot be compared. Just not. Additionally I must say that I never read about such an enormeous difference between SPDIF and I2S, although everybody does hear "the" difference. This is just not normal, and I am not sure what to think of this. However, theoretically there is this difference :

In OS mode the jitter specs are a few ps only. I am using that now.
In NOS mode jitter is subject to the amount of jitter the DAC is fed with. Remember, this is why I wanted the I2S connection, because I wanted NOS mode. The jitter from SPDIF can well be 200ps or much more. From I2S I don't know it, but I already have my thoughts, looking at the scope and the way steady picture of the perceived clock data (I will measure everything officially in due time).
So, I think I can fairly state that the sweetness is coming from less jitter. Or the other way around, the roughness as how I know it, comes from high amounts of jitter.

Keep in mind, I am doing something here which other people didn't do before me, and I mean not in the consistent setup of (actually) NOS, a most high grade PSU and tweaking an I2S connection from a PC. And some fine speakers to hear the difference within a second and blahblahblah.

Now, proceeding with the sound quality it seems that I have to remap my mind/memory/expectations from music through loudspeakers;
I know the sound of NOS so well (what about 30 months in a row listening for differences at developing XXHighEnd) that it (yeah what) has become a reference for me. A kind of absolute reference on how e.g. a synthesizer must sound. The same counts for trumpets and everything with very high transients. Of course because it all sounded natural it was allowed to have that reference. But the reference was wrong ...

Earlier in this topic I think I said (or maybe it was offline somewhere) that the "sharpness" of this DAC (just think squares) made my horn speakers resonate at certain frequencies. Also, those frequencies would create standing waves in the room, and e.g. women voices may become unevenly harsh spread over the frequency spectrum concerned. What I did not tell is that I got rid of that by means of some "softener", and the softener just was the (TVC) preamp again. It rounds all squariness so much that all just is fine again.

But guys, the only thing this DAC does is presenting everything very very good as how it receives it. I showed you the square wave at 22050 Hz, and if you can find one picture on the Net that shows a better one ... be my guest. And that was SPDIF with its jitter ...
Now, what the I2S connection shows is that the additional "roughness" the DAC expresses is just jitter from SPDIF; Currently there is no such thing anymore of horn resonance or standing waves at higher frequencies.

The strange thing (for me) at listening to synthesizers, and of course compared to before, is that there now is again "sweet" detail in between the squary tones. Possibly this is best explained when I refer to the feedback of the cymbal to the stick which became audible with this DAC, which has the sweetness I refer to. This is now everywhere, and even a trumpet is not *as* squareish as I thought before.
And please keep in mind how difficult it all is, because like one can just never know how a synth should sound, one also can't know how square a trumpet is blown, which in the end is the same as one can't know how hard the strings are pulled from a bass so metal sound comes from the strings. So, all these things could trick at least me, and it now appears that beyond "natural sound" another dimension exists : real sound. So let's say that natural sound doesn't sound wrong and mimics instruments in general, but real sound makes an instrument sound as how it was played. Hmm ...

The latter gives quite some opportunities. I mean, having all things sounding natural is what I have been working on for a long time, and once you think it can't be improved, the fun is over. But when we now discover that there's also this other dimension, we can gladly be in search of improvements forever, because we just won't/can't know how instruments were played.
I say it once again, the metal from the basses is the most profound thinkable, and there was really nothing in me that could expect it was in the data. Still it is and it could be unveiled.

Right. So the DAC is ready now ? Hell no.
With the just learned data I think some other things can be tweaked. The I2S connection is not the final one, but I first want to measure whether this is ever going to make a difference.
Whether I faked NOS or not, with the current setup all is going through the SRC. Not the best for theories.

To be continued. yes
Peter
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For the Stealth III LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - July 17, 2021 (2.11)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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« Reply #79 on: January 14, 2009, 11:41:10 am »

This is is fantastic reading, Peter!

I had a NOS DAC myself for more than a year, and I agree 100% with the "sharpness of transients" which you refer to. This kind of realisme I have not heard from any other DAC. In the end I sold it though, and bought a more "conventional" OS DAC - my present Stello Eximus. It doesn't have quite the same "sharpness" or slam, but is muuuuch more detailed and relaxed. All in all, a better SQ. (But I still think about my old NOS when I am lonely in the night. Like an old lover). The point is that my NOS DAC (DDDAC) was made with obsolent mid-fi Philips DAC-chipsets, which probably put a negative stamp on the final result. I am very interested in re-trying a NOS DAC which is based on a modern DAC-chip like the Buffalo.

Something else, Reference Recordings  is now selling true mastertape copies with original quality 24/176.4. 176,4 is quad of 44,1. Can you make XX work on this 176,4 samplingfrequency?
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« Reply #80 on: January 14, 2009, 12:31:25 pm »

Quote
I am very interested in re-trying a NOS DAC which is based on a modern DAC-chip like the Buffalo

Haha, I don't know whether you meant to say that the Buffalo is NOS ? but if you did ... it is far from it !

Quote
Can you make XX work on this 176,4 samplingfrequency?

Well old lover, this should be in there since 09u-12 (April 4 2008).
Did you miss it all this long time, or don't I understand what you want here (like playing a tape maby ? too much !)
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For the Stealth III LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - July 17, 2021 (2.11)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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pedal
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« Reply #81 on: January 14, 2009, 12:41:32 pm »

Quote
I am very interested in re-trying a NOS DAC which is based on a modern DAC-chip like the Buffalo

Haha, I don't know whether you meant to say that the Buffalo is NOS ? but if you did ... it is far from it !

Quote
Can you make XX work on this 176,4 samplingfrequency?

Well old lover, this should be in there since 09u-12 (April 4 2008).
Did you miss it all this long time, or don't I understand what you want here (like playing a tape maby ? too much !)

I missed it! These hi-rez files from RR has just entered the marked. I havn't bought any, but it is in the pipeline. Good to know XX are allready there.

Sorry for mixing up the words here. What I was unclear about, was that my previous DAC also was FILTERLESS. No anti-aliasing, no roll-of. My guess was/is that you are using the Buffalo in filterless mode too?
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« Reply #82 on: January 14, 2009, 01:04:23 pm »

Ah, the old lover is a bit confused !

It looks like you haven't read the whole topic here;
Although the Buffalo was mentioned here and there, and although I indeed built one (as Leif did) this topic is about my own assmbled DAC, worldwide commonly known as "Phasure NOS1". swoon Okay, in a year that is, I hope.

The Buffalo (AKA ESS Sabre) can't work filterless, as this is a heavily oversampling 1 bit Delta Sigma whatever DAC.
I would not call that sweet, but very good instead. Very good if you don't like NOS or just didn't experience NOS. Although I really cannot tell, with a decent PSU it is most probably better than your Eximus. However, if I had to listen to it as "my DAC", I'd go to bed early. Like an old lover acting young. Well, it's all been said in an earlier post in this topic.

The NOS1 indeed is assembled as NOS and filterless. But it can run in several combined modes.
To avoid confusion : what I was talking about in the earlier large post, was OS mode, tweaked to NOS behaviour running 16/44.1 at 176400 and without filter, connected via native I2S.

For your interest on "modern DAC chips", this runs on 4 PCM1704UK chips (2 x 2 balanced mode).
Peter

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For the Stealth III LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - July 17, 2021 (2.11)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
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« Reply #83 on: January 14, 2009, 03:39:13 pm »

For your interest on "modern DAC chips", this runs on 4 PCM1704UK chips (2 x 2 balanced mode).
OK. That is also a top of the shelf DAC chip. Looking forward to follow your development!
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« Reply #84 on: January 16, 2009, 06:20:31 am »

What material are you going to mount this beauty in?  I'd prefer your cardboard setup to metal.  Think of a nice thick piece of not very dense type of wood  (experiment with varnishes) with a nice thick acrylic top...

and a
12V car- or motorcylce battery
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« Reply #85 on: January 16, 2009, 06:58:20 am »

acrylic gets static and has no schreening properties and is thus a STUPID choice
imo
best
Leif
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« Reply #86 on: January 16, 2009, 12:47:38 pm »

I don't think it will be wood, or it must be additional decoration. Wood doesn't act much as a shield, and to me it doesn't look exactly better either. Personal of course.
And as Leif said acrylic ... the same.

I am still fighting with the I2S solution and the space it will need, which is the main reason I can't proceed on this hence show anything. But I will as soon as I'm done with it.

On battery power ...

So far I don't see (by measuring) how that would impact the performance of the DAC. Not in this case, not with this PSU.
This is all in the context of the distortion I have on my mains, which is rather - no the most bad anyway. Note though that a distortion like this - and as how I expressed it can be noticed (just through speakers) is unrelated to the provision of power. IOW, there is no way this tone is coming into the DAC, and that it amplifies it or wants to D/A it or whatever.
The DAC is about the most steady PSU for voltage and current imaginable, and it does just that. For example and your imagination, if I'd connect a 100W lightbulp to the supply the DAC is using, and assuming all can bear the amperage coming from that, nothing will ripple or change. This is the self defending mechanism of the PSU, which comprises 95% of the DAC circuitry. This is also why the DAC has such a low forceful output, because nothing can steal current from it, and with a DAC this would be mainly the DAC fighting itself.

Besides this, like many I have my doubts about battery power;
Dave, is you have a PS Audio and you have it for quite a while, move it out of the way for a few minutes and listen. If you say "all is worse" then you're ok. But I don't think you will say that.

Of course, battery power for main amps etc. is very different from battery power for DACs, and main amps surge more. But there is more to it (the theories) and together with me not liking the result those theories might just as well be true.

Then there is also the given fact that this is a device which fully operates in Class A. You can read the newspaper by the light emitting diodes used (which are used as speciasl diodes) and the thing gets warmer than my Audio Note tuby DAC. And there goes the battery solution.
Of course, on this matter you could use a car battery which will last 24 hours for sure, but it will impact the design of the PSU because all is not exactly running on 12 Volts (and not less but more).

During my measuring experiments (starting this weekend) I will try to find proof of a battery making a difference by measurement. And if any mains is prone to improvement, it is mine.

Peter
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For the Stealth III LPS PC :
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XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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« Reply #87 on: January 16, 2009, 02:47:05 pm »

why don´t you move into one of these!:


* pitstone2.jpg (18.64 KB, 292x419 - viewed 3408 times.)
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« Reply #88 on: January 16, 2009, 04:52:51 pm »

Quote
Besides this, like many I have my doubts about battery power;

My experience with them is mixed:
Because I wanted less noise I made a psu for my tubepreamp which converts 12V from a caravan-battery to 220V.
A lot of capacitance behind it so worked OK. The switching frequency is below the noise.
When I put a AC/DC supply of 12V instead of the battery it sounded really bad.
Back to my old AC/DC 220V supply was really bad too.(and it was supposed to sound very good)
So I settled for the battery, but still some noise, maybe the tubes?
Then an extra AudynCap capacitor close to the battery and a much lower noisefloor!
Now I don't like this because it means I can hear the quality of this capacitor and of the battery...
Besides the overnight charging which I sometimes forget.
So for A DAC it's a nice experiment but not garanteed to work.
If you can make it to work let us know how it sounds!
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« Reply #89 on: January 17, 2009, 03:25:46 pm »

Maybe its me, but I LIKE the sweetness you mention. Get that from the absolute best situations here, with exceptionally clean power during holidays etc. when much of the people living around me is away.

Sweetness=Nirvana.

But that's only me... Happy

As Leif mentiones, he has very good results WITH OS. Don't think thats a dead cow.
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