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Author Topic: Q1 setting = +4  (Read 22316 times)
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pedal
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« on: January 12, 2009, 12:17:26 pm »

Lately there has been a lot of emphasize on the SQ differences between the new versions of XX. However I remind you there are also important SQ differences regarding settings of Q1.

The last 12-18 months I have preferred Q1 = -2. It gave me a very liquid and smooth sound, without adding any veil or coloration. In contrast, the +14 setting, was felt to be (a little bit) too “dry”.
However now, I feel that the -2 setting is slightly too soft sound. Too pleasant. Moving up to +4 strikes a good balance between -2 and +14.

I advice you to experiment with Q1 settings once in a while, and especially after upgrading your equipment and after upgrading to new versions of XX. Right now +4 is my winner.
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« Reply #1 on: January 14, 2009, 10:27:48 am »

your profile says 09v6a.....are you still there or?
does your rec q. set refer to 09w6 or 7?
best
leif
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« Reply #2 on: January 14, 2009, 11:17:03 am »

your profile says 09v6a.....are you still there or?
does your rec q. set refer to 09w6 or 7?
best
leif

Yes 09v6a till now. But now I see that you and the others have moved on and are happy, so I'll try the latest version too.
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« Reply #3 on: January 14, 2009, 01:23:10 pm »

9w6 is in another league!
imo
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leif
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« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2009, 03:21:49 pm »

I tried Q=+4 with 09w7 and did not hear much for a short test.
Then I upgraded to 09w8 and thought there was a clear improvement!
Details sounded very clear, instruments more seperate in space behind the speakers.
I played an album of Nynke Laverman, a frisian singer with a very distinct sound.
The frisian words are sometimes difficult to follow when you don't hear frisian everyday.
Now it was much easier to hear what she was singing about.
But... who was singing, was this really Nynke? No it could be anybody, the distinct colour of her voice was completely gone.
So back to Q=+14 and there she was again. The color of her voice replaced the abundance of detail.
I did not find the compromise yet but am very curious what this slider is doing to the sound!
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« Reply #5 on: January 20, 2009, 03:49:17 pm »

As long as you can measure that all stays bit perfect, it's okay. whistle
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*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
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« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2009, 03:30:07 am »

Lately there has been a lot of emphasize on the SQ differences between the new versions of XX. However I remind you there are also important SQ differences regarding settings of Q1.

The last 12-18 months I have preferred Q1 = -2. It gave me a very liquid and smooth sound, without adding any veil or coloration. In contrast, the +14 setting, was felt to be (a little bit) too “dry”.
However now, I feel that the -2 setting is slightly too soft sound. Too pleasant. Moving up to +4 strikes a good balance between -2 and +14.

I advice you to experiment with Q1 settings once in a while, and especially after upgrading your equipment and after upgrading to new versions of XX. Right now +4 is my winner.


I think all of this is very important thinking, but, for me the differences in going from +14 down to my usual ~ 0 area are that 14 starts to sound thick/slow/veiled and ~0 starts to sound see through/quick/alive ... I don't think I'd refer to -2 as ever too soft... too thin, or strident is what I might use on some recordings...
which brings me to this:
Over time I don't feel I've seen a post where people can agree that a specific Q1 setting is doing the same on both systems.  It seems to me that Q1 is computer/electrical/system dependent and that a certain Q1 setting on one system is going to sound different on another system.  Just saying, I think we're on our own on this one ... no collaboration possible.

I tried and liked +4 for awhile, but I'm back to 0 for now.  I do tend to move Q1 around from -2 to +4 at this point in time.
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« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2009, 07:08:07 am »

People with the same DACs should be able to find the same Q1 setting. But it still depends on the kind of music I think.
With my previous DAC I played a long time with 4, but always with classical/violins I kicked it up to 14. It was too obvious that violins were too thin at the lower levels. Otoh you could say that the lower levels (for my previous DAC) weren't good for anything, but I liked it anyway.
So I'm afraid this is personal.
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XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
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For a general PC :
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*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
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« Reply #8 on: February 18, 2009, 02:10:28 pm »

I just installed the 09-x2 and was looking for the best Q1 settings. I also was using +14, but today i put +2 and I seem to like it.
Any advice for this version? Happy

Edit: compared with +2 and +14, I also prefer +4 Happy
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« Reply #9 on: April 10, 2009, 02:13:18 pm »

Q1 at -2 doesn't work on my system, after a couple of minutes the music "blows up". Freaked me out when it happened! Q1 at 4 sounds a whole lot more dynamic then at 14. Love those steep learning curves...... Wink
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« Reply #10 on: April 10, 2009, 02:36:43 pm »

Oh yes, sure it can go wrong. For sure it will at the top side; I don't think I heard anyone about the bottom side, athough ... I think I could let that flaw with a USB DAC I had once ... It just breaks up.
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W10-14393.0 - July 17, 2021 (2.11)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
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« Reply #11 on: April 10, 2009, 07:59:22 pm »

Prefer 14,30,30,0,0 with version 6a. 14 sound better, more "sharp" and defined.
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« Reply #12 on: May 25, 2009, 09:46:16 am »

After extensive listening this morning (AFI1 -> D70 -> Stax headphones), and using P70 transport for comparison, I'm back to -4/0/0/0/0!

There is a 'lightness' with this setting that I lose otherwise. At +4/30/30/0/0, things get 'heavy', as though the musicians are playing in treacle.

If you have this CD, listen to tracks 3 and/or 6 of 'Memoirs of a Geisha' - beautiful music, beautifully recorded. But instruments like the bass drums can drown out the ebb and flow of the music with +4/30/30/0/0. But not with -4/0/0/0/0!

I'll happily put up with the latter's 'edginess' because it allows me to follow the emotional content of the music better. (I might switch to +4/30/30/0/0 whenever I want to relax in the evening... or when I'm in the mood for really deep, heavy bass).

Mani
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« Reply #13 on: May 25, 2009, 12:12:56 pm »

Nice explanation ... and rather well following the principles on it in the software ...

Btw, a bit of a pitty that you compared -4/0/0/0/0/ with +4/30/30/0/0/ so there's two variables in the equation.

If I'm allowed to put them into their elements (for what I know of it) I say :

-4 or more thinny sound than +4
0/0/0/0 is more honest sound than 30/30/0/0 (but less allows your room to play a role <-  grazy)


Ask me again in a year's time, and my response will be really crazy. Happy
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For the Stealth III LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - July 17, 2021 (2.11)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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« Reply #14 on: May 25, 2009, 02:42:06 pm »

After extensive listening this morning (AFI1 -> D70 -> Stax headphones), and using P70 transport for comparison, I'm back to -4/0/0/0/0!

There is a 'lightness' with this setting that I lose otherwise. At +4/30/30/0/0, things get 'heavy', as though the musicians are playing in treacle.

Interesting... did you try +4/0/0/0/0?
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(2nd Apr 2018)
Software:
W10 14393 Pro x64 | XXHE 2.10 | MinOS | Q=14x1/0/0/0/0 | SFS 5,19 mixed contiguous | Nervous rate 1 | 4096k buffer |

Hardware:
OrigenAE H5 case | E5300 fanless |  8GB RAM | Winmate DC-DC fanless PSU | OS on SSD | Renesas USB3 pcie card | Belden highspeed usb cable | Audio-gd dac19 NOS with sigxer F1 | My_ref_FE mono amps | Albedo Apex speakers
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