XXHighEnd - The Ultra HighEnd Audio Player
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Author Topic: XX vs. J River sound quality?  (Read 18779 times)
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LydMekk
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« on: September 18, 2009, 01:03:47 am »

Anybody else compared XX to J Rivers playback software?

Actually thinks J River sounds very nice here in demoversion. A little probs getting it to shift and lock to 44Khz but else it sounds nice. Good perspective and a little more "alive" in the midbass than XX IMO.

Your thoughts?
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Dedicated PC - E6850 @ 3.6G - 8GB - 7TB - W7-64 Ultimate - Q=14,0,0,0,0 Noinv DoubleON - Anti Image - Pros Scheme 3 - Player/ThreadPrio Realtime - Volume 0db - Lexicon MC-12B Pro/Pre/DACs - HighEnd 7.1 System - All formats supported. XX=0.9y-8c, attended and unattended(!). Creative XFi Elite Pro, DAC is 24/96 and 32 bits is ticked.
Telstar
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« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2009, 03:13:22 pm »

Jriver sounds more or less like Foobar or any other wasapi player under vista.
Moreover Jriver volume control doesnt work (because it stupidly change the windows volume which is disabled when u use wasapi/kernel mode).
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summers_tim
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« Reply #2 on: November 04, 2009, 03:19:29 pm »


Hi, I tried the J River for a while, but in my mind there is no comparison.  For starters, I couldn't stop the clicking and skipping, so it is ruled out.  (Admittedly I didn't try very hard - but I shouldn't have to, since other players don't ever suffer from this problem.)  Then, I agree with Telstar - nothing really distinguishing, sounds nice for a while but then I tend to wander off and do something else...  Doesn't stand out.

A shame as I like the concept and the front end is nicely thought through, but in the end if it doesn't cut it on the SQ, then what's the point?  I didn't extend after the demo version expired.

XX still sits on the throne.

Tim

HP Laptop / Vista, XX 0.9y-4, Empirical Audio Off-Ramp, Chord DAC64, Red Wine Audio Signature 30.2, Zu Druid 4, all cables by Zu.
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HP Laptop / Vista, XX 0.9y-4 Arc Pre / Double, Empirical Audio Off-Ramp 3, Chord DAC64, Red Wine Audio Signature 30.2, Zu Druid 4, all cables by Zu.
LydMekk
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« Reply #3 on: November 04, 2009, 03:37:32 pm »

Agree. This was before 9y-4 with ARC pred. That version rules supreme atm. concerning SQ.
I felt XX was on a wrong heading soundwize before Peter launched 9y-4 but no more.

XX again is king on the hill regd. SQ IMO.
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« Reply #4 on: December 29, 2009, 05:55:56 pm »

Strange, I haven't any problems with audio output in MC14. While my 1616M is getting a mod I have been using the Peachtree Nova's USB and sound is stable.

I just tested out XXHighEnd as a player. I found this part in "Hey Lloyd I'm Ready to be Heartbroken" at 1:14 where I think the song peaks and clips with the singers voice. I honed in on that after a while as a reference.

Using J. River at 32/96 upsampling vs. XXHighend's proprietary Arc upsampling (double/engine3) at 32/96 I thought that XXHigend sound edgier and raw on that vocal, but it was very subtle. Eventually I just could not tell a difference, or at least enough to merit using the very low usability-factor XXHighend. I will do some more listening.

I used my AKG 702s and Raptor headamp fed by my crummy X-Fi at work as my new DAC is not here yet. No ReplayGain or volume leveling was employed on either player. J. River was set to play from memory and use ASIO4ALL output.

I'm getting my 1616M back today so I will try at home on the hifi with some native 24/96 material.

DC
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Speaker: Win7x64 JNC81 (SSD) + PicoPSU 80w → EMU 1616M (BNC) → Peachtree Nova (BNC)→ Eastern Electric 6BM8 → Omega 3i + Deep Hemp
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« Reply #5 on: December 29, 2009, 06:11:05 pm »

I'm getting my 1616M back today so I will try at home on the hifi with some native 24/96 material.



Try 16/44 material instead
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« Reply #6 on: December 29, 2009, 06:14:56 pm »

I plan to try 16/44 upsampled but I also want to compare players playing back native 24/96 material.

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Headphone: MC14 FLAC 24/96 → HiFace (BNC) → Eastern Electric DAC → Raptor → AKG 702 (ALO silver)
Speaker: Win7x64 JNC81 (SSD) + PicoPSU 80w → EMU 1616M (BNC) → Peachtree Nova (BNC)→ Eastern Electric 6BM8 → Omega 3i + Deep Hemp
Digital RIAA: Bix→ MG1 Linear → Grado Reference → AEA ribbon preamp → Black Sparrow ADC → EMU1616M → Samplitude (RIAA + Algorithmix) → EMU1616M → Peachtree Nova BNC)
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« Reply #7 on: December 29, 2009, 10:59:50 pm »

IMHO, to hear the real benefits of Arc Prediction, you really need to use it in Quad mode... with a 176.4/192K-capable NOS filterless DAC...

Yes, not too many of those around, I know.

Mani.
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Main System:
Phasure Mach III (Win 14393.0 on RAM-OS / controlled by RDC, / connected directly to music server / XXHighEnd 2.11 / Minimize OS / Engine#4 Adaptive / DB=4096 / Q1=10 / xQ1=15 / Q3,4,5=1 / SFS=4.00 / XTweaks = 34, 10, 0, 0, 0 / Straight Contiguous / Clock Resolution = 15ms / Scheme 3-5 (low/realtime) / 8x Arc Prediction / switch #5 'up/off' / Unattended) mobo USB3 port -> Lush^3 -> Phasure NOS1a B75 G3 -> 8m Blaxius^2 -> First Watt F5 mono amps -> Tune Audio Anima horn speakers
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PeterSt
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« Reply #8 on: December 30, 2009, 09:24:15 am »

I found this part in "Hey Lloyd I'm Ready to be Heartbroken" at 1:14 where I think the song peaks and clips with the singers voice. I honed in on that after a while as a reference.
[...]
I thought that XXHigend sound edgier and raw on that vocal, but it was very subtle.

Hi,

Be very careful with clipping tracks and Arc Prediction ...
Obviously clipping isn't right in the first place, but Arc Prediction will pronounce hard clipping. Chances even exist it chokes on it (ticks) knowing how difficult it has been to work around hard clipping of which I found three versions, but maybe a fourth exists ...

In the next version (0.9y-5) it will be the other way around, and clipping (soft or hard) is utilized into "peak extension" (hey Mani, I could have made up another phenomenon for it, but extending peaks is just what it does, so I thought to call it the same (re HDCD)).

Thanks, Peter
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XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
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*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
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« Reply #9 on: December 30, 2009, 10:55:38 am »

... hey Mani, I could have made up another phenomenon for it, but extending peaks is just what it does, so I thought to call it the same (re HDCD)

Works for me.

Mani.
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Main System:
Phasure Mach III (Win 14393.0 on RAM-OS / controlled by RDC, / connected directly to music server / XXHighEnd 2.11 / Minimize OS / Engine#4 Adaptive / DB=4096 / Q1=10 / xQ1=15 / Q3,4,5=1 / SFS=4.00 / XTweaks = 34, 10, 0, 0, 0 / Straight Contiguous / Clock Resolution = 15ms / Scheme 3-5 (low/realtime) / 8x Arc Prediction / switch #5 'up/off' / Unattended) mobo USB3 port -> Lush^3 -> Phasure NOS1a B75 G3 -> 8m Blaxius^2 -> First Watt F5 mono amps -> Tune Audio Anima horn speakers
Office System:
Phasure Stealth II -> Lush^2 -> RME ADI-2 Pro FS R -> Neurochrome 286 mono amps -> Tune Audio Marvel horn speakers
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« Reply #10 on: December 30, 2009, 04:02:20 pm »

I haven't looked at the waveform yet, just seems to peak there and there is some grit in the singer's voice.
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Headphone: MC14 FLAC 24/96 → HiFace (BNC) → Eastern Electric DAC → Raptor → AKG 702 (ALO silver)
Speaker: Win7x64 JNC81 (SSD) + PicoPSU 80w → EMU 1616M (BNC) → Peachtree Nova (BNC)→ Eastern Electric 6BM8 → Omega 3i + Deep Hemp
Digital RIAA: Bix→ MG1 Linear → Grado Reference → AEA ribbon preamp → Black Sparrow ADC → EMU1616M → Samplitude (RIAA + Algorithmix) → EMU1616M → Peachtree Nova BNC)
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