XXHighEnd - The Ultra HighEnd Audio Player
April 24, 2024, 11:55:57 pm *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length
News: August 6, 2017 : Phasure Webshop open ! Go to the Shop
Search current board structure only !!  
   Home   Help Search Login Register  
XXHighEnd > Ultimate Audio Playback > Chatter and forum related stuff > Arc Prediction & high-bandwidth amp - a disaster waiting to happen?
Pages: [1]
« previous next »
  Print  
Author Topic: Arc Prediction & high-bandwidth amp - a disaster waiting to happen?  (Read 7990 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
manisandher
Crazy Audiophile
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2112

from-first-principles.com


View Profile WWW Email
« on: August 25, 2011, 09:29:58 pm »
Continuing with my 'super-fast amplifier' saga, something has occurred to me.

Some of the highest bandwidth amps around are from Spectral. Now, Spectral are totally adamant that you need to use a Spectral preamp and Spectral/MIT interconnects with their power amps. The warranty is void if you do not do this.

The reasoning here is that the power amp has a bandwidth of DC-3MHz. It will amplify any ultra-high-frequency signal/noise that enters it. The Spectral preamp and the Spectral/MIT cables ensure that all ultra-high-frequency signals are filtering out before reaching the power amp.

You may ask why Spectral don't just lower the bandwidth of their amps then. Well, this would reduce their speed/slew-rate. So by having a high bandwidth, but filtering the signal, they manage to have ultra-fast amps that don't expend all their energy on amplifying HF signals and blow up as a result. Apparently, Spectral amps really do blow up if not used with the 'correct' preamps and cables.

Now... Arc Prediction actually creates ultra-high-frequency signals/noise. The NOS1 will pass these on perfectly to the power amp (if no preamp/vol-pot is used, as recommended by its Maker). Wouldn't this be a really bad idea with an ultra-high-bandwidth power amp???

Thoughts please...

Mani.
Logged
Main System:
Phasure Mach III (Win 14393.0 on RAM-OS / controlled by RDC, / connected directly to music server / XXHighEnd 2.11 / Minimize OS / Engine#4 Adaptive / DB=4096 / Q1=10 / xQ1=15 / Q3,4,5=1 / SFS=4.00 / XTweaks = 34, 10, 0, 0, 0 / Straight Contiguous / Clock Resolution = 15ms / Scheme 3-5 (low/realtime) / 8x Arc Prediction / switch #5 'up/off' / Unattended) mobo USB3 port -> Lush^3 -> Phasure NOS1a B75 G3 -> 8m Blaxius^2 -> First Watt F5 mono amps -> Tune Audio Anima horn speakers
Office System:
Phasure Stealth II -> Lush^2 -> RME ADI-2 Pro FS R -> Neurochrome 286 mono amps -> Tune Audio Marvel horn speakers
PeterSt
Administrator
High Grade Audiophile
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 16837



View Profile Email
« Reply #1 on: August 25, 2011, 11:11:52 pm »
Any other simple questions ?

This ultra whatever high frequency energy is already 40dB down towards 96KHz. More can't be seen/measured.

I would be bothered more about 96KHz "HiRes" which is 3dB down in that regions ...

If they advise those cables, well, take them. But I wouldn't be so sure it works out for the better. Hard to tell ...

Peter
Logged
For the Stealth III LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - July 17, 2021 (2.11)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).
For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.
Global Moderator
BertD
Audio Enthusiast
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 422


Only the Best!


View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #2 on: August 26, 2011, 09:57:22 am »
Quote from: manisandher on August 25, 2011, 09:29:58 pm
Some of the highest bandwidth amps around are from Spectral. Now, Spectral are totally adamant that you need to use a Spectral preamp and Spectral/MIT interconnects with their power amps. The warranty is void if you do not do this.

In other words the amp is not stable where the least thingy at the input makes it fry itself?

So filters are needed to protect the amp so why not put it inside the amp (as most manufacturers do) giving people free choice to use anything they want around it?

Do these amps have a CE certficate?  unsure

I am not a technical expert but isn't filtering (no matter where applied) always reducing the Slew Rate seen at the speaker terminals?

Bert
Logged
Februari 1st: RDC controlled i7-4785T (set to 800Mhz - fully passive design without any moving parts), 16GB RAM / XXHighEnd 2.04c on 2GB RAMDisk (IMDisk) / Windows 10 Pro 10586.0 X64 on internal 250GB SSD / Music on external NAS / Playback Drive 10GB RAMDisk (IMDisk) / SFS 0.10 / Barbone Industrial Intona > Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) > Blaxius BNC interlink > BD-Design BD30-SPR amplifiers > BD-Design Custom Made Sigma loudspeakers.

XX settings basically similar to PeterSt's
manisandher
Crazy Audiophile
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2112

from-first-principles.com


View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #3 on: August 26, 2011, 10:26:38 am »
Hey Bert, I don't really know. Maybe there's a lot more to all this than meets the eye. In case you didn't know, the chief designer at Spectral is Keith Johnson, who is very well respected... oh and happened to be one of the designers of my PM2 ADC/DAC.

Mani.
Logged
Main System:
Phasure Mach III (Win 14393.0 on RAM-OS / controlled by RDC, / connected directly to music server / XXHighEnd 2.11 / Minimize OS / Engine#4 Adaptive / DB=4096 / Q1=10 / xQ1=15 / Q3,4,5=1 / SFS=4.00 / XTweaks = 34, 10, 0, 0, 0 / Straight Contiguous / Clock Resolution = 15ms / Scheme 3-5 (low/realtime) / 8x Arc Prediction / switch #5 'up/off' / Unattended) mobo USB3 port -> Lush^3 -> Phasure NOS1a B75 G3 -> 8m Blaxius^2 -> First Watt F5 mono amps -> Tune Audio Anima horn speakers
Office System:
Phasure Stealth II -> Lush^2 -> RME ADI-2 Pro FS R -> Neurochrome 286 mono amps -> Tune Audio Marvel horn speakers
BertD
Audio Enthusiast
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 422


Only the Best!


View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #4 on: August 26, 2011, 01:49:22 pm »
Quote from: manisandher on August 26, 2011, 10:26:38 am
Hey Bert, I don't really know. Maybe there's a lot more to all this than meets the eye.

Probably but still, if only a few cables different than their own can make the amp fry then there is seriously something wrong with the basic design of the amplifier.

Filters as used in those MIT or their own interconnects should then be used inside the amplifier if you ask me...

But perhaps then technical figures look a lot worse to impress?

I do not want to be negative but do correct me if I am wrong...

Bert
Logged
Februari 1st: RDC controlled i7-4785T (set to 800Mhz - fully passive design without any moving parts), 16GB RAM / XXHighEnd 2.04c on 2GB RAMDisk (IMDisk) / Windows 10 Pro 10586.0 X64 on internal 250GB SSD / Music on external NAS / Playback Drive 10GB RAMDisk (IMDisk) / SFS 0.10 / Barbone Industrial Intona > Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) > Blaxius BNC interlink > BD-Design BD30-SPR amplifiers > BD-Design Custom Made Sigma loudspeakers.

XX settings basically similar to PeterSt's
Pages: [1]
  Print  
« previous next »
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1 RC2 | SMF © 2001-2005, Lewis Media Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.118 seconds with 19 queries.