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Author Topic: How .9u Sounds  (Read 59947 times)
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Gerard
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« on: February 17, 2008, 11:37:34 am »

Peter,

Thanxxxxxxxx again  Happy This really sounds fantastic!! Man what a magician you are!! thankyou sounds good !

The moment i began to play the first thing that crossed my mind was that it indeed sound different. Like you told us before. It really needs a moment to get use to the differences.... But nothing more than a moment.. Grin
The second thing was that it somehow sounded a bit "Warmer". But not to much.....
The thing i also nodiced was that there is peace in the room. Music and the room where it is played in, are now two separate things....

All 'n All everything falls into place.......

Thank you very much! Happy



« Last Edit: February 18, 2008, 05:00:01 pm by Gerard » Logged

Januari 2017 XX 2.05
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16GB, *Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0* *from RAM*, music on music server / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *0.10*  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core *3-5* / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive *none* (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Not the best (OS from RAM issue) / Time Stability = Off (OS from RAM issue) / Custom Filter Mid 705600 / -> USB3 (Silverstone both sides isolated = Sw#3 of NOS1a = Up) -> *Clairixa USB 15cm* -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 0.70m -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink ->> Metrum Amps ->> Metrum Acoustics ESL Open Baffle.
PeterSt
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« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2008, 12:03:16 pm »

Quote
The thing i also nodiced was that there is peace in the room.

This is a great description which I noticed myself in the exact same way. Somehow you "need" a description for it which actually does not exist (so far). "Peace" is what came to our mind in this house ...

Mind you, I think this goes along with this (and I referred to it in the Releasenotes by the too low volume not being important anymore) : actually somehow it doesn't matter anymore how loud things play. The "peace" I think is derived from that. Something like "no need to change things".

But wait a minute ... did I say I was ready ?
swoon
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Gerard
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« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2008, 01:39:18 pm »

actually somehow it doesn't matter anymore how loud things play.

Yes this is what i forget to write.... When before you need to open up the volume to hear everything. (Clarity) Now even at low volume clarity is (more) there...  very happy

Grtz
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OriginAE x11v Home build HTCP ~ Asus x79 mobo 3930K 12 core underclock 500 MHz,
16GB, *Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0* *from RAM*, music on music server / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *0.10*  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core *3-5* / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive *none* (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Not the best (OS from RAM issue) / Time Stability = Off (OS from RAM issue) / Custom Filter Mid 705600 / -> USB3 (Silverstone both sides isolated = Sw#3 of NOS1a = Up) -> *Clairixa USB 15cm* -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 0.70m -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink ->> Metrum Amps ->> Metrum Acoustics ESL Open Baffle.
PeterSt
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« Reply #3 on: February 18, 2008, 12:20:49 am »

Gerard,

I'm sure you are familiar with playing "your" so called good music at a birthday party etc. Then, when the big day is there you play those carefully selected tracks, and there you are ... uh-ohh ... doesn't that disturb ? second is that someone asks you to put the volume down. Of course you don't want that but you agree anyway. That someone actually is right ...

Now, not that I recently bumped into such a situation, but it is the very first time in my life that this whole evening the music is playing (not loud) and I don't even notice it while being behind the computer screen. By this I can tell that something is very very different.
When I pay attention to the music playing I hear everything indeed, and when I do not pay attention, nothing disturbs me ... I don't hear anything.
My wife tells me the same without asking.

The mind peace experience !
dntknw


Here is a most crazy observation (don't laugh) : Besides I ask our 9 year old son to tell me when he hears "anomalies" in high frequencies which he might be able to capture while I myself am not capable of anymore because of, say, old age (which he indeed tells if so), I can "measure" him as a device when the music plays right. He swings it out like a young kid can do ...
Well, at least for some 3 hours each evening the music blasts through the room here, and exactly since 0.9u is playing here he seems to be the most swinging man on this earth. Such a kid is not under any control ...

For Dave (SeVeRd) : try it out on your daughter. secret
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W10-14393.0 - July 17, 2021 (2.11)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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Gerard
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« Reply #4 on: February 18, 2008, 10:43:42 am »

Peter

Nice writing!  Happy

Yes Yes Yes........ I have a day off  Happy And listening for a few hours now to my new discovered music collection!  Grin I can tell you that i am really enjoing myself with this great new .9u present too much ! too much !

Back to how peacefully it sounds or call it somekind of serenity that come's to my ears... Was it so irritating/stressed before this?  unhappy Well no and yes i guess. The thing i also nodiced is that before after a few moments of listening and i put the music OFF that the peace than was comfortable. Now there is no difference between OFF and PLAYING
Even when i play Slagerij van Kampen. (Big drums)


Quote
but it is the very first time in my life that this whole evening the music is playing (not loud) and I don't even notice it while being behind the computer screen.

You are so totally right there, it is possible to switch effortless between some writing and back to the music again... Like a ON/Off button in your head.  wacko


EDIT: There was a day that i asked you this.... 
http://www.phasure.com/index.php?topic=278.msg1774#msg1774

Well afterall (though in a different way) i think you fixed it!!!  rofl rofl rofl rofl rofl rofl


 Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin

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Januari 2017 XX 2.05
OriginAE x11v Home build HTCP ~ Asus x79 mobo 3930K 12 core underclock 500 MHz,
16GB, *Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0* *from RAM*, music on music server / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *0.10*  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core *3-5* / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive *none* (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Not the best (OS from RAM issue) / Time Stability = Off (OS from RAM issue) / Custom Filter Mid 705600 / -> USB3 (Silverstone both sides isolated = Sw#3 of NOS1a = Up) -> *Clairixa USB 15cm* -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 0.70m -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink ->> Metrum Amps ->> Metrum Acoustics ESL Open Baffle.
PeterSt
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« Reply #5 on: February 18, 2008, 01:45:49 pm »

Hey Gerard,

As long as we both are not the only ones experiencing it like this, I guess it is a not before discovered phenomenon. It should be in the league of "getting into the music" (which everybody understands) but more vague to understand when you never had the experience.
Btw, it is not something I created explicitly ... the only thing I did was making something more 1:1 again (hahaha, that helps for explanations).

Now how to call it ? the level of ... what ? How to describe it to those who never experienced it ...

Clarity sure is not it. I know of a "super clarity" system that just implies for the opposite : uneasyness. Shut off please !
All the technical properties it has (like clarity is one of them) do not decribe this total feeling. Similair to the (unknown !) properties that would describe/create "getting into the music".

You, I think, could say that it has a degree of "seeing the players". At least that is a feeling that comes over me at listening to horns, violins and voices. This by itself seems to be created by a means of "tightness" (hard to describe for me in english) like a super-stable voice. You can feel that things match up in air ... phase related. A bit similiar to a two-wat loudspeaker system where the bass and the mid/high can match or not. Coherent.
But this again all doesn't describe the sensation. It's still properties only (which not necessarily give the sensation, I'm sure).

"Sensation" itself might be in the area ...
But this may be relative to "less -" or "no sensation". Mind you, here too -similar to getting into the music- it looks like there's no gradation. So, although I can't be sure, it's there or it's not.
Spooky ...

Presentness. Yeah, somehow you can describe it like this, with the "not being present" as the positive side. But, this doesn't fit the directness everything expresses. So it's confusing.
That "presentness" is inconsistent with itself (as described) is an interesting matter ...

Gerard, you said the room is separated from the music now. This one didn't occur to me, but I think you are right. How ? what actually happens then ?
Maybe this "room separation level" is something to work with. But then I'd first have to listen and pay explicitly attention to that phenomenon.

Possibly this is not a separation from the room, but a separation from everything. I mean, it already occurred to me (and I really wondered) why I was closely listening to the music quality itself, french fries boiling in oil making a havy noise right behind me, the cooking hood at full power ditto ... and I found myself rathert explicitly thinking "I don't care !". Normally I wouldn't even start to sit down and listen seriously. So ...

... Concentration level. Ah, that seems a good one ! And mind you, it already exists in our world of audio. Maybe it's not very well defined and spoken of, but I think we all know about *or* your attention is with the music *or* you find yourself thinking of something else while you should have payed attention to such and so, and now the moment has passed.

Interestingly enough it -then- is this same concentration level that allows you to NOT pay attention to the music. To me this is almost more strange than being able to concentrate on the music. Like I told about it in the previous post ... typing stuff like this and during such mind setting there is just *no way* I heard music. Room separation, subject separation, concentration separation.

Officially it wouldn't help, but let me repeat at this stage that I told about CD Playback always having been wrong as I see it. So now I do it right. Just right, that's all.

Might this be similar now to the natural realism of you being in a room with 30 people, two people opposite of you with a table in between and you talking to those people, while right behind you -closer than the people you talk to- other people are talking, and you are not disturbed by that at all ? you are able to concentrate on the people you talk to. The others talk louder, but actually you don't hear them. You hear the people you talk to.
Now compare the same situation, but music plays. I think we all know, it doesn't need to be loud at all to disturb. Why ? is this because it is so much unnatural that our brain can't get it out of the way ?
Note that I don't have the experience yet of playing music at this birthday party, but that I feel that it won't harm anymore.

If I'm on the right track, is "naturalness" a property ? Ok, it could (or should !) but as an ICTer I say this is an inheritent and composed property of many other properties. So, useless. Naturalness could be way to describe the sensation though, but on the other hand ... what defines naturalness then. Me ? nope. We rather need that property that defines naturallness. Like "concentration level" is prone to it (I think).

There might be other properties that allow for more easy comparison (which "concentration level" does not, like "getting into the music" does not) and this seems to be an explicitly added warmth to instruments;
If you listen closely, you can sense that harmonics are (re)created in air. I talked about this (elsewhere) maybe one year ago already, and it occurred at certain pre-Engine3 versions. What I mean is, that harmonics of an instrument need not to be in the recorded data, in order to let the base tone characteristics recreate that harmonics anyway. I'm not sure whether it is *this* that creates the sound as of now ...

What I hear in really everything is a perfect added sound that came from under - upwards (in dutch : van onder uit). Like base tones were lacking, and *those* are added now. Can this be ? hardly. It more looks like the proof that undertones actually do exist and that *those* are able to be profound now (similar to just everything is more profound). Whether they are in the recorded data or are recreated in air ... I don't know at this time.

Ok, I stop here for now, because I tend to change my own subject.

Concentration level. rofl

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For the Stealth III LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - July 17, 2021 (2.11)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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« Reply #6 on: February 18, 2008, 02:47:36 pm »

At first it seems to me as a dynamic range compressor effect.
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« Reply #7 on: February 18, 2008, 03:24:23 pm »

... which has what audible properties ? (I just don't know ...)
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W10-14393.0 - July 17, 2021 (2.11)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
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« Reply #8 on: February 18, 2008, 03:34:29 pm »

Simply put it makes the loud part sound lower and еоу lower part sound louder. It seems like more detail:)
But of course it is DSPing which I don't expect from XX. So as I said it just reminded me the effect of it.
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1. USB FreeAgent 500Gb -> P4 2.8 2gb RAM Vista Ult  -> XXHE Q1=14 prio both = Normal -> esi juli@ (SPDIF is default device->analog mon in ESI panel->analog outs) -> nad 320BEE->Boston Acoustics cr150
3. IBM thinkpad r52->VIsta Ult XXHE, Unattended playerprio=Nothing threadPrio=Normal -> very cheap usb audio adapter -> shure attenuator -> headphones shure 210 Happy
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« Reply #9 on: February 18, 2008, 03:52:49 pm »

Ah ... ok. No, I do nothing of the kind. Also I don't recognize the part "loud sound lower". I guess that you think it does because the lower parts seem to express ? Happy So no, all levels express similarly. Well, to my ears. Wink
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XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
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« Reply #10 on: February 18, 2008, 04:04:57 pm »

Gerard, you said the room is separated from the music now. This one didn't occur to me, but I think you are right. How ? what actually happens then ?
Maybe this "room separation level" is something to work with. But then I'd first have to listen and pay explicitly attention to that phenomenon.

Possibly this is not a separation from the room, but a separation from everything. I mean, it already occurred to me (and I really wondered) why I was closely listening to the music quality itself, french fries boiling in oil making a havy noise right behind me, the cooking hood at full power ditto ... and I found myself rathert explicitly thinking "I don't care !". Normally I wouldn't even start to sit down and listen seriously. So ...

... Concentration level. Ah, that seems a good one ! And mind you, it already exists in our world of audio. Maybe it's not very well defined and spoken of, but I think we all know about *or* your attention is with the music *or* you find yourself thinking of something else while you should have payed attention to such and so, and now the moment has passed.

Interestingly enough it -then- is this same concentration level that allows you to NOT pay attention to the music. To me this is almost more strange than being able to concentrate on the music. Like I told about it in the previous post ... typing stuff like this and during such mind setting there is just *no way* I heard music. Room separation, subject separation, concentration separation.

Officially it wouldn't help, but let me repeat at this stage that I told about CD Playback always having been wrong as I see it. So now I do it right. Just right, that's all.

Might this be similar now to the natural realism of you being in a room with 30 people, two people opposite of you with a table in between and you talking to those people, while right behind you -closer than the people you talk to- other people are talking, and you are not disturbed by that at all ? you are able to concentrate on the people you talk to. The others talk louder, but actually you don't hear them. You hear the people you talk to.
Now compare the same situation, but music plays. I think we all know, it doesn't need to be loud at all to disturb. Why ? is this because it is so much unnatural that our brain can't get it out of the way ?
Note that I don't have the experience yet of playing music at this birthday party, but that I feel that it won't harm anymore.

If I'm on the right track, is "naturalness" a property ? Ok, it could (or should !) but as an ICTer I say this is an inheritent and composed property of many other properties. So, useless. Naturalness could be way to describe the sensation though, but on the other hand ... what defines naturalness then. Me ? nope. We rather need that property that defines naturallness. Like "concentration level" is prone to it (I think).


Peter,

I think you have a good point here.. Indeed music alway's has been something that whas anoying present in room with a bunch of people or to our wife as well. And than they say that a man cannot do two things at a time.. arrogant Happy.. I can say that for 80% of the time that i push the volume button of my receiver she touch the button as well. ( But in a whole different direction than i did.)  unhappy I really am going to have a test according to this. Wink

Strange thing is though (like you told) that in a conversation with someone in the same room and with the same amount of people you are capable of shutting thoose people down to come into your head and you are capable of concentrate to one person. That's alway's bin rather easy. Just like a clock tikking or a train in the bagground or cars driving on a highway. these are also blocked to come into our brains. ( After a few moments) Why not when a cd was playing.

And maybe naturalness is the word.... But cars driving as well a train what is so natural about that? Well we can say that the sound that come's from that are easy going. For our brain easy going that is. Maybe specifiek frequensie's Alway's where anoying.  dntknw

Quote
Possibly this is not a separation from the room, but a separation from everything. I mean, it already occurred to me (and I really wondered) why I was closely listening to the music quality itself, french fries boiling in oil making a havy noise right behind me, the cooking hood at full power ditto ... and I found myself rathert explicitly thinking "I don't care !". Normally I wouldn't even start to sit down and listen seriously. So ...

They alway's say that the room and the furniture that is in that room infects the SQ.... Like a stone floor ed. IMO also that not anymore.... It looks like that does not have anything/so much to do with each other... But there i could be wrong... It just feels like it dntknw

Quote
What I hear in really everything is a perfect added sound that came from under - upwards (in dutch : van onder uit). Like base tones were lacking, and *those* are added now. Can this be ? hardly. It more looks like the proof that undertones actually do exist and that *those* are able to be profound now (similar to just everything is more profound). Whether they are in the recorded data or are recreated in air ... I don't know at this time.

I also was wondering what it is.... Is there so much more to discover on a cd......

 Happy
« Last Edit: February 19, 2008, 11:08:32 am by Gerard » Logged

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« Reply #11 on: February 18, 2008, 07:47:33 pm »

Hi,

I have to insist, that I really feel physical discomfort with this new sound. As if something is wrong in digital domain.
Or a bad jitter.

I admit there is more details now and such... I agree with all described by now.
Except that I feel that weird again as if I listen to a jittery CD. Although I don't get paranoid Happy it is just not right somehow.

Could we ask Carlos Rodríguez, what does he think.

Andrey
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3. IBM thinkpad r52->VIsta Ult XXHE, Unattended playerprio=Nothing threadPrio=Normal -> very cheap usb audio adapter -> shure attenuator -> headphones shure 210 Happy
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« Reply #12 on: February 18, 2008, 08:21:27 pm »

Hi,

I have to insist, that I really feel physical discomfort with this new sound. As if something is wrong in digital domain.
Or a bad jitter.

I admit there is more details now and such... I agree with all described by now.
Except that I feel that weird again as if I listen to a jittery CD. Although I don't get paranoid Happy it is just not right somehow.

Could we ask Carlos Rodríguez, what does he think.

Andrey


ouch
I'm just getting started this morning on the set up.  Just dled and waiting for tubes to warm up.  Have to admit I'm a bit scared of this all.  My dac only accepts 16/44 or 16/48 (i've been setting Win at 16/44) so I'm not sure having a digital vol in there will be good....but ya, bout ready to try it all here.

I know Andrey has pretty good ears (having found an upper mid range peak I had when he listened here.. which I've gotten rid of and isn't prominent at higher vol...), but I'll still go in listening to this new version with open ears... wish me luck, heh.
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« Reply #13 on: February 19, 2008, 01:38:40 am »

wish me luck, heh.

Well, Good luck then !

...

Still alive ?  Happy
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For the Stealth III LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - July 17, 2021 (2.11)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
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« Reply #14 on: February 19, 2008, 01:45:35 am »

I have to insist, that I really feel physical discomfort with this new sound. As if something is wrong in digital domain.
Or a bad jitter.

Okay Andrey, thank a bunch !
Now I understand your post here : Volume and bit perfect setting ?
You suffer from a bad case of harmonic distortion ...

I recognize now what you mean, and what may appear to be good sound ... is not. Not for you anyway.
Can you tell me please : Can you cope with nos-DACs ?

Anyway, I will build in dither and then let's see again. I hope to do it tomorrow (Tuesday).

Peter
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For the Stealth III LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - July 17, 2021 (2.11)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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