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Author Topic: Help me find a new DAC  (Read 38370 times)
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PeterSt
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« Reply #15 on: October 12, 2009, 12:41:11 am »

16/192.

yes
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A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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« Reply #16 on: October 12, 2009, 01:07:40 am »

16/192.

yes

OK, thats bold.

makes jou wander, yes
 Happy
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« Reply #17 on: October 12, 2009, 01:51:35 am »

Altmann Attraction DAC?

16/192.
yes

This is one I'd looked at and thought about, but didn't get because I wanted to use XXHE volume - 16 bits isn't enough.  I like the basics of its design.  dunno if battery is ultimately trustworthy, but maybe...If all you run is 16/44.1 material double arc oversampled and no XXHE volume (you have a preamp)... well, I'd sure like to hear this thing with XXHE,  gut feeling says it sounds decent/better than what I've got, (except for the volume part). 1K isn't cheap either though
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« Reply #18 on: October 12, 2009, 07:28:23 pm »

Well if you cant wait or afford the NOS1, your best bets are IMO to stay with the same dac chip and get a good implementation.
The Naim in your list fits the bill (but it is very close in price), the Audio-GD dacs are also good values, esp the reference one at 1500$+shipping and taxes.
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W10 14393 Pro x64 | XXHE 2.10 | MinOS | Q=14x1/0/0/0/0 | SFS 5,19 mixed contiguous | Nervous rate 1 | 4096k buffer |

Hardware:
OrigenAE H5 case | E5300 fanless |  8GB RAM | Winmate DC-DC fanless PSU | OS on SSD | Renesas USB3 pcie card | Belden highspeed usb cable | Audio-gd dac19 NOS with sigxer F1 | My_ref_FE mono amps | Albedo Apex speakers
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« Reply #19 on: October 12, 2009, 07:35:44 pm »

Thanks for the replies guys, I have ordered a DAC today and am eagerly anticipating it. Will post some impressions once I have got the chance to use it a bit.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2009, 08:02:03 pm by PeterSt » Logged

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« Reply #20 on: October 12, 2009, 09:53:18 pm »

Just for the record since Roy meantioned me:

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/digital-line-level/137976-experience-diy-dac.html

This DAC costs 100 euro's on e-bay and sounds more then 10 times the money..
But you have to put it in a box yourself and it realy starts to sing when you use outputtransformers (20 euro extra).
And for that you need to know what a soldering iron is.

I think it can only really be beaten by Peter's DAC!  Wink
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« Reply #21 on: October 13, 2009, 09:05:03 pm »

Quote
Just for the record since Roy meantioned me:

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/digital-line-level/137976-experience-diy-dac.html

This DAC costs 100 euro's on e-bay and sounds more then 10 times the money..
But you have to put it in a box yourself and it realy starts to sing when you use outputtransformers (20 euro extra).
And for that you need to know what a soldering iron is.

I think it can only really be beaten by Peter's DAC! 

GerardA... so do you have this DAC and how you like it?  it looks interesting and I am interested in getting one.
however, being that most good dacs are thousands of dollars in price and way out of my range.. maybe this one could work...
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« Reply #22 on: October 13, 2009, 11:14:39 pm »

Hi Beto,

Of course you should buy Peter's DAC!
But while waiting the Hong Kong DAC is very good value for money.
You can find it here:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Gigawork-24%2F192-Up-sampling-DAC-DA-CONVERTER-w%2F-USB-kit_W0QQitemZ120474001273QQcmdZViewItemQQimsxZ20090927?IMSfp=TL090927141006r431

In the diyaudio link there are options for improvement. I put outputtransformers in stead of the opamps and
this really makes it a HighEnd DAC.  Everytime Digital(XXHE) gets better I try to improve my Vinyl but I'm afraid
digital has won now..
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« Reply #23 on: October 14, 2009, 06:09:25 pm »

Hi GerardA..

Of course I will try to buy Pete's dac when its out, but for now, I ordered this one to get my hands wet... this is the very first dac I buy..
I never was interested in too much audio gear or should I say snake oil coming from the audiophile world... but after I attended the RMAF, it all changed, I saw the light!... Happy I even now believe in power cords..... Happy...

Thanks bud!
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« Reply #24 on: October 16, 2009, 10:29:46 am »

Ok, so I got a Moodlab Concept NOS DAC for using until the Naim DAC comes out. Seems like a proper product based on rational principles. It will do max 16/96. Will report back one I'd had a chance to live with it a bit.

    
- analog output: unbalanced output (RCA) , 1.6V rms
- Low Jitter receiver from ST + Philips TDA1543 combo for digital signal reception and conversion
- passive I/V conversion using high quality Vishay resistor to preserve signal integrity
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« Reply #25 on: October 16, 2009, 11:04:53 am »

Ok, here I am with a little preliminary feeback, hence my idea. I must say, I wrote a larger story already two days ago, and during writing it, I got dissatisfied myself. So, this is actually about ANOTHER idea, and to me it looks way better than the previous.

Notice : All I'm doing here is cutting down on the price for a "world's best DAC" hoping that everybody can enjoy it.

Allright. I am writing right now because it already took too long, but to be honest I must do some soldering to test "the thing" from my idea. I'm not telling yet what that idea is (depends on the soldering results too), BUT that the price now can be 2165 euro if you only like a most strange setup.teasing So, start to be afraid in advance, but I think you will like this even better than whatever the original idea was.
No, nothing changed about the DAC itself nor will the quality change, but it is about the idea of Arc Upsampling which brings new "hardware" possibilities here (go figure !) and for which I have to do some soldering. And some programming btw.

I hope to know everything tomorrow night, and besides the price, already for the "functionalities" this will bring, I hope this idea works. But remember, it will be strange !

If it doesn't work I sure will have disappointed you, but it 100% sure is worth the try. You will see ...

More tomorrow.
Peter
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For the Stealth III LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - July 17, 2021 (2.11)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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« Reply #26 on: October 18, 2009, 04:27:50 pm »

Hi Peter,

Great work You have done so far. I have some remarks and a request about your development of world's best DAC:

Quote
Notice : All I'm doing here is cutting down on the price for a "world's best DAC" hoping that everybody can enjoy it.
In mine opinion this is a contradiction. World's best products are sadly enough not for everyone.

Quote
the price now can be 2165 euro 
This is a league to high for me. Please make a second DAC the Poor Man's NOS DAC for about 700 euro's! Then there are more "everybody's". Great change that I will become a buyer.

Regards,
Johan
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« Reply #27 on: October 18, 2009, 05:35:33 pm »

Quote
the price now can be 2165 euro 
This is a league to high for me. Please make a second DAC the Poor Man's NOS DAC for about 700 euro's! Then there are more "everybody's". Great change that I will become a buyer.

Regards,
Johan

I'm afraid that that price point would incur more compromises that Peter is willing to make.
I remind you that he is selling the DAC without taking int account all the time spent and the money for the test equipment, and with a very little markup. If he were a <insert your favourite highend brand> the DAC would cost from 8k euros up.
That's the naked truth.
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(2nd Apr 2018)
Software:
W10 14393 Pro x64 | XXHE 2.10 | MinOS | Q=14x1/0/0/0/0 | SFS 5,19 mixed contiguous | Nervous rate 1 | 4096k buffer |

Hardware:
OrigenAE H5 case | E5300 fanless |  8GB RAM | Winmate DC-DC fanless PSU | OS on SSD | Renesas USB3 pcie card | Belden highspeed usb cable | Audio-gd dac19 NOS with sigxer F1 | My_ref_FE mono amps | Albedo Apex speakers
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« Reply #28 on: October 27, 2009, 03:24:48 pm »


But while waiting the Hong Kong DAC is very good value for money.

In the diyaudio link there are options for improvement. I put outputtransformers in stead of the opamps and
this really makes it a HighEnd DAC.  Everytime Digital(XXHE) gets better I try to improve my Vinyl but I'm afraid
digital has won now..

Hello Gerard,

for this price I could not resist to try this dac. Could you tell me whether you use it for XX with upsampling Arc Predicted in double or quad ? You use it with coax I see, how do you get from PC to Spdif ? And as I have some trafo's that could be used I would like to try your modification as well, could you give a (brief) description or link on what you did ?

thanks,

Leo
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« Reply #29 on: October 27, 2009, 04:00:35 pm »

Hi Leo,

I use SPDIF from a motherboard connector (Gigabyte). Before I used the SPDIF-output from my Terratec FW 24, but this sounded less good, rough and to forward. I just finished a 2m RG59 cable for SPDIF since I moved the DAC the 1m cable was to short and I had to use a 6 meter cable which sounded less convincing. Now with 2 meters it's sounding good again.

My experience says not to use an extra soundcard, but I guess depends on hardware (PC/DAC) and cable.

Optical output I tried and sounded almost as good as coax. (A little softer/watery/less good timing/punch...)

Since Gerard is using this DAC too it would be interesting to know his experiences too!

I thought I was using quad with Arc but it seems it's Double now. Maybe 176 is not supported by Windows or XXHE, have to check this sometime, but it sounds so good I did not feel the need to do that yet.

The modifications can be found at DIYaudio.com. :
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/digital-line-level/137976-experience-diy-dac.html

Even there you can find new modifications I did not try yet.

Gerard.
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