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Author Topic: Intona High Speed USB 2.0 galvanic isolation  (Read 174657 times)
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PeterSt
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« Reply #60 on: January 02, 2016, 06:39:43 pm »

Hey Alain,

I myself hope I am going to say / reason this correctly :

[...]

I already had an answer but scratched that because I ran stuck on it myself. This would be a better one :

With the assumption that both means of isolation - in the NOS1a internals and in the Intona, are the same (they isolate galvanically) the best option would be to DISconnect the black ground wire. Then all stays the same as how it was with NOS1a isolation only (and advice with that is to disconnect the wire). But, it would be fair to state that the situation can only be the same when the USB cable is plugged in.
I stop here, before I run stuck again. :nope:

Peter


PS: Before people may not understand what to do with the NOS1a : Bespoke black wire disconnected is the same as Switch #3 Up (Off). This, except for the two first customers who received a new NOS1a, where the Switch was not applied yet - but these know about that.
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A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
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*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
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« Reply #61 on: January 02, 2016, 06:50:28 pm »

Ehm, just to be sure (it's cold here and my brain does not have enough calories to function fast haha)...

So yes, I leave the black wire disconnected in the NOS1 and I maintain the isolation of the USB card from the PC chassis - not matter if the Intona is between the PC and NOS1 or not ?

Alain Happy 

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« Reply #62 on: January 02, 2016, 07:37:45 pm »

Hope I do not push too hard - it's the best hardware component I could buy for the SQ ( ... the second best after Phasure NOS1 of course Wink ) It seems that there was no isolation at all until the Intona isolator was plugged in no. I guess that only NOS1 users can imagine what happened here after using he DAC with isolation sounds good ! Too much to write down here ...

Georg
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« Reply #63 on: January 03, 2016, 09:44:41 am »


Very nice Georg !
Of course you realize that it is still your own fault ... yes

Best regards,
Peter
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« Reply #64 on: January 03, 2016, 09:49:46 am »

Quote
Ehm, just to be sure (it's cold here and my brain does not have enough calories to function fast haha)...

So yes, I leave the black wire disconnected in the NOS1 and I maintain the isolation of the USB card from the PC chassis - not matter if the Intona is between the PC and NOS1 or not ?

Alain, this is about about too few calories (but always drink sufficiently Wink) ... I just did not respond fully to *your* situation ...

What I recall of it, is at the moment we created the isolated Silverstone (ground of it not connected to the PC's chassis), the black wire was removed from its (screw) position as well. So indeed, the consistent situation for NOS1 (not a) would be :

Isolated Silverstone + loose black wire in NOS1;
or
Not Isolated Silverstone + connected black wire in NOS1.

Peter
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A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
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« Reply #65 on: January 03, 2016, 12:13:18 pm »

Quote
So indeed, the consistent situation for NOS1....
Hi Peter,

Best wishes for 2016.

Please could you describe the situation/connection for the pc..silverstone..itona..black wire/switch3 for the nos1a?

Thanks.

Regards,
Johan
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« Reply #66 on: January 03, 2016, 12:19:19 pm »

Hi Peter,

People who have the NOS 1a with Silverstone card (not isolated), what should they do, if they have the Intona now.

Best regards,

Arvind
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« Reply #67 on: January 03, 2016, 01:55:59 pm »

Guys ... to be honest, I can't tell because I am not "interested". Maybe that is wrong, but I just never gave it a thought.

My Silverstone is isolated from the PC's chassis, and I have the black wire not connected. And an Intona in the chain.
That was so and it remained so because it didn't have my attention.

You could say : all is relative. So for example, I have my Silverstone isolated for some reason, which worked out. Arvind has his Silverstone NOT isolated, also for some reason which apparantly worked out for him. It would now be ILLEGAL if I'd try to overrule that with a "that is wrong for the Intona situation".

The ONLY thing wrong with the approach in general, is that I do not / did not revisit the whole situation. But hey ...
I can't tell it enough ... when I am happy with the sound and all, I am - contrary to most of you, I think - just happy and I will NOT experiment infinitely with things I could theoretically experiment with. Maybe when I am used to things and I am ready for something new *and* I have the time for it.

Something else maybe : It can't harm to try a few things yourelves. Also, it is not always so that the theoretical best situation also sounds the best (it should, but since when do we know about ALL the apects involved ? (haha)). I mean : I don't think there's any danger anywhere to try combinations with the (mind you) NOS1a.

Hope this helps ...
Peter
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XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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« Reply #68 on: January 03, 2016, 02:41:33 pm »

I did not like the sound of the Silverstone either isolated or not. Today I use one of the usb2 MB ports and switch three "up," meaning the NOS1a-75b black ground wire is "disconnected." Here Silverstone adds a flavor that renders the sound no longer neutral.

Regarding the disconnected black wire in the DAC, I was the one who originally reported waking up to booming noises one night after I disconnected the wire without using an isolated Silverstone card. BUT that was with the NOS1. Since the NOS1a, I have played as described, switch 3 up (black wire disconnected) and have never had a problem. Leaving switch 3 up takes a bunch of grain or noise out of the sound.

 It is important to use Peter's findings as a guide but, given that all systems and ears are necessarily different, some deviation is sometimes required.  Happy
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« Reply #69 on: January 06, 2016, 12:16:48 pm »

The Intona is here, and I've had a bit of a listen to it on the system in my home office, which includes a NOS1a and a nice Genelec active speaker system (my main hifi system is currently down).

Well what can I say that hasn't already been said?

The sound has just 'cleaned up'. So much more realistic. I've A/Bed a few times with a direct USB connection and the difference really is night and day.

This Intona is GREAT! And great value for money too, at less than EUR 300 (for the Industrial). I have absolutely no affiliation with Intona (or Phasure, or any manufacturer for that matter), but I'd say that you need to beg, borrow or steal EUR 300 to buy one of these babies.

HTH.

Mani.
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« Reply #70 on: January 07, 2016, 11:03:11 am »


This Intona is GREAT! And great value for money too, at less than EUR 300 (for the Industrial). I have absolutely no affiliation with Intona (or Phasure, or any manufacturer for that matter), but I'd say that you need to beg, borrow or steal EUR 300 to buy one of these babies.

HTH.

Mani.

Hi Mani,

nice to read.

Question: the price is excl. VAT?

Joachim
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« Reply #71 on: January 07, 2016, 11:03:45 am »

Put the Intona into the system today...nice sound, probably better than what I had before but I have barely used the system over the summer holidays so don't really have a good reference...will know in a couple of days time.

Anyway, I run my Silverstone USB card from two LPS: one for the 5V that goes down the USB cable and one to run the card itself (it does not draw power from the PCIe slot.  There must be something going on inside the Intona because it is now pulling 0.23A from one of the LPS whereas before the draw was negligible.  I have not read the blurb for the Intona but it must require a base load to do what it does...interesting.
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Audio PC
Stealth Mach II with Xeon E5 2698 v4 20 Core 2GHz  with Hyperthreading On [40 cores]/ 32GB Ram / RAM-OS / mobo USB port

XXHighEnd 2.11 RAM-OS (W14393 RAM)
Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Buffer 4096 / Q1/3/4/5 = 14/1/1/1 / xQ1 = 1 / Processor Core Appointment Scheme = Core 1-3 / PlayerPrio = Low / ThreadPrio = RealTime / ClockRes = 1ms / Not Switch during playback = off / Xtweaks Balanced Load = 43 / Nervous Rate = 100 / Cool when idle = 1 / Provide stable power = 0 / Utilize cores always = 1 / Time Stability = Stable / Time Performance Index = Optimal / SFS 0.90MB Max 120MB / Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect = on / Start Playback during conversion = off / Do not start playback at all = off / Copy to XX-drive by standard = on / Always clear Proxy before Playback = on / Stop Remaining Desktop Services = on / Stop Desktop Services = on / Stop Remaining Services = on / Stop WASAPI Services = on / Stop W10 Services = off / Keep LAN Services = on / Persist = off / Use Remote Desktop = on/ Arc Predict / Minimize OS = on / Peak Extend = off / Unattended

Audio Chain
Stealth MachII PC >> Lush^2 USB 1.1m >> NOS1a G3 B75, Driver v1.0.4 (4ms) >> Blaxius^2 >> 10Y DHT Preamp >> 6 way active horn speakers (Single Ended Triodes)
manisandher
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« Reply #72 on: January 07, 2016, 12:11:07 pm »

Question: the price is excl. VAT?

Hi Joachim, yes the price I paid was EUR 289, excluding VAT and excluding the shipping cost. But really, it's still very good value for money in this hobby.

HTH.

Mani.
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Main System:
Phasure Mach III (Win 14393.0 on RAM-OS / controlled by RDC, / connected directly to music server / XXHighEnd 2.11 / Minimize OS / Engine#4 Adaptive / DB=4096 / Q1=10 / xQ1=15 / Q3,4,5=1 / SFS=4.00 / XTweaks = 34, 10, 0, 0, 0 / Straight Contiguous / Clock Resolution = 15ms / Scheme 3-5 (low/realtime) / 8x Arc Prediction / switch #5 'up/off' / Unattended) mobo USB3 port -> Lush^3 -> Phasure NOS1a B75 G3 -> 8m Blaxius^2 -> First Watt F5 mono amps -> Tune Audio Anima horn speakers
Office System:
Phasure Stealth II -> Lush^2 -> RME ADI-2 Pro FS R -> Neurochrome 286 mono amps -> Tune Audio Marvel horn speakers
PeterSt
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« Reply #73 on: January 07, 2016, 12:12:41 pm »

Quote
I have not read the blurb for the Intona but it must require a base load to do what it does...interesting.

Well, it is an active device. Something with two FPGA's in there at least (which is what Intona tells) and undoubtedly a few more things.
And a led. Happy
No, two.
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For the Stealth III LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - July 17, 2021 (2.11)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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arvind
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« Reply #74 on: January 07, 2016, 01:57:56 pm »

Hi Guys,

Plugged in the Intona (industrial) a couple of days back & the sound is great. Hard to describe the improvement in words, seems like the noise floor is significantly lower. Besides I can go down to 0.05 SFS( earlier 0.15), which further improves the SQ.

Great find Peter. Thank you.

Best regards,

Arvind
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W10-14393.0 RAM OS / Mach III LPS 14/28/XXHE 2.11/Engine#4/Adaptive Mode/16x /Custom Filter/Q1= 14/0/0/0 xQ1=1/Device Buffer:4096/Invert Phase=On/Minimise OS/PE=off/Unattended/Stop All Services/SFS=20.69/20.69(max)/ClockRes= 15ms/Straight Contiguous/Music on HDD/Lush^3 USB cable A:W-Y-R-G; B:W-Y-R/Phasure NOS 1a/75b/G3 USB DAC. > Blaxius*^2.5 A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink. Orelo MK II active speakers. ET^3 between Mach III & music server. Driver version 1.04/Driver Buffer 16ms. OSD text = Off
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