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Author Topic: New Filter request(s)  (Read 141895 times)
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acg
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« Reply #105 on: July 05, 2014, 11:23:46 pm »


Thank you Alain.  Much appreciated.

Anthony
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Stealth MachII PC >> Lush^2 USB 1.1m >> NOS1a G3 B75, Driver v1.0.4 (4ms) >> Blaxius^2 >> 10Y DHT Preamp >> 6 way active horn speakers (Single Ended Triodes)
christoffe
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« Reply #106 on: July 06, 2014, 04:19:24 pm »


Okay, three things: I'm really surprised that more NOS1 owners, standard and upgraded, haven't posted 186i impressions. The sound on my system is the best ever, again.  Happy

Hi,
in general it is difficult to get the same result/opinion of  a “software/hardware” test due to the different systems/rooms we are listening with/in and personal preferences.

1)   test of 1.186-i – Custom at 16x AP 
                              
replay of acoustic music/instruments such as

a)   first track on the Brian Bromberg CD
http://www.amazon.com/Wood-Brian-Bromberg/dp/B000FQJPBO/ref=sr_1_5?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1404651943&sr=1-5&keywords=brian+bromberg
and
b)   first track also on the Al DiMeola CD
http://www.amazon.co.uk/All-Your-Life-Tribute-Beatles/dp/B00E1SM5UA/ref=sr_1_3?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1404652122&sr=1-3&keywords=al+dimeola

There is a very detailed replay with an amazing resolution. A superb metallic sound of DiMeolas guitar strings.
You can hear the picking of the bass strings very, very clear. It seems that the recording microphone is appr. 0,5m away from the instrument. (Brian Bromberg)
I hear less reverberations/resonances of the instruments and 3D image as used too.

2)   test of 1.186-i – 16x AP       
The recording microphone moved away from the instruments (Brian Bromberg), so less resolution (different characteristic of the filter), better 3D image and more reverberations/resonances of the instruments.

3)   test of 1.186-i – 8x AP       
Best overall performance with a seamless soundstage, nice 3D image, instruments (acoustic bass and guitar) have body and a perfect integrated bass.

Joachim

P.S. We have an open kitchen/living room area of appr. 55m², and our listening SPL is around 70dB(A) only.
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PeterSt
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« Reply #107 on: July 07, 2014, 10:25:31 am »

Thank you for your extensive reporting Joachim.

With your post as a guide I tried 8x normal AP against 16x AP-Custom against 16x normal Ap myself yesterday. Just press Pause in the middle of a track and switch a couple of times.

Maybe I can hear what you mean. But this is my own "verdict" :
(let's keep in mind, I listen to 16x AP Custom now for many weeks (over 8 I think) so this has become my automated reference)

16x AP (normal) brings quite similar overtones in cymbals everywhere which seem right but can not be because too much the same throughout. This looks like *additional* harmonics but in comparison with the Custom filter at least I now perceive it as distortion.
This "distortion" is now more profound with the NOS1a because of the way lower distortion the DAC itself now produces.
Also good to know : this distortion in the really higher frequencies (think about 12KHz) can easily be measured. No worries because this is just normal for a filter serving the time domain almost exclusively.

8x AP (normal) did not bring much of a difference. Notice that I played it in the sequence as you read it here and maybe it was not wise to first try 16x AP normal. So how it works : 16x AP normal brings me not the best (see above) and thus a next setting is to improve on that specifically. But it can't work because nothing was done to the distortion mentioned (it will even have gotten somewhat worse).
So ... there might have been a difference, but it did not want to go into my head because overwhelmed by things more important (as how my brain interprets it).

Now notice that I in fact started out with 16x AP Custom because I was just playing that all the time and started "testing" in the middle of some longer track.

Back to 16x AP Custom;
When it is performed in this sequence, but I think my 8 weeks of using this anyway, this becomes uper apparent :
Richness. So what lacked in both normal AP session -and what I did NOT notice - now is super apparent when going back.

Of course this is the same harmonic richness Charlie talked about and - just saying - it is also 100% logic. There just *is* more HF output to begin with (for level I mean) but is is also "distorted" at levels which theoretically should be OK. Or at least far better OK (I am talking about measuring it all now).
This richness can be put to words better if I describe it as "more vibrant" and then envisioning this more vibrant as the whole left/right experience, in the end making the sound clearly more full. Like a warm bath thrown at you (gently).

For you Joachim, it could be worth while to explicitly watch for this. On the other hand, I did NOT watch explicitly for your remarks because the track playing coincidentally was not right for that. And I actually had reasons for comparing (but with your post in mind).
So here we go again with one of my "sh*tty" albums :

Made in Japan (Deep Purple) - original version (watch out for that super bad remaster);

This is always a test album for me because it is about fairly much smashing on cymbals of which you can hear that there's more in it than shown (through your system). Ever back this started for me with "all grey" because, well, I played the LP so many times it just was grey.
Through CD this is different, because through CD (or computer playback) this is about how much of cymbals come to the surface.
The fun (MY fun) : The cymbals seem to be "over" now. Seem to be, because how to judge well with a 1971 rock album. But point is : since NOS1a this now happens for the first time and where now all the smashing is heard very well it suddenly becomes a matter of "and how to represent those well". This thus while previously it was a matter of "how to bring them to the surface". So really a big difference.

Because the filter adds to the highs I started to A-B. Just the first track (Highway Star).
The 16x AP brought the overtones at always the same frequencies as described and if there's one thing I hate it is "not neutral". The 8x AP did not change a thing to that. The 16x Custom made it disappear again. All what lacks that is just too much of it (in my subjective view of course and it will depend a lot on the speaker). Plus all got so nicely rich and full.

Not much important for this post (say against your post Joachim) but when Child in Time came up ... man, that now shows playing on the ride cymbal I never perceived. So, a ride cymbal (used in ride fashion) always shows the best of cymbals (say 40 years again also) but this time I could see how the stick was hitting the cymbal from various angles (you must have seen drummers doing that in the first place to get that into your bain from listening only). But not only that, smaller cymbals are used just the same for "ride".
Never ever I got a glimpse of this in this track, and possibly I played it 500 times in my life.
OK, I just wanted to share this because it is a typical example of how a certain album or track can show huge differences while others stay close to the same. But remember what I said : I often use this album for testing, just because I can "hear" that there's more in there than shown through my system. And now that finally happened.
(I so often give Sgt. Pepper as THE example of things being in there which don't come out - and today this whole album sounds totally gorgious (believe it or not) ... most Beatles do now).

Anyway, watch for that richness / fullness. I even played a double album of the Beastie Boys throughout. This did not work ever before because too lean. Now it works (but head for a fight with your wife Wink).

Regards,
Peter







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XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
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acg
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« Reply #108 on: July 07, 2014, 10:33:06 am »

Hi Peter,

I don't know if it is because I have been listening to iPod audio at my friends place for the past 3 days or whether the new 1.186-i Custom filters are revolutionary, but since installing it when I got home from a short holiday this afternoon the sound is truly holographic.

I will compare tomorrow with 1.186-d and original AP that I was running before my holiday, but 1.186-i does sound very nice.  

One question though.  If I just select AP in 1.186-i is this the standard AP that I have been running for the past year or so or have you altered it?  In other words, do I need to run 1.186-d again to get a decent comparison or can I just flick between AP and "Custom"?

Regards,

Anthony
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XXHighEnd 2.11 RAM-OS (W14393 RAM)
Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Buffer 4096 / Q1/3/4/5 = 14/1/1/1 / xQ1 = 1 / Processor Core Appointment Scheme = Core 1-3 / PlayerPrio = Low / ThreadPrio = RealTime / ClockRes = 1ms / Not Switch during playback = off / Xtweaks Balanced Load = 43 / Nervous Rate = 100 / Cool when idle = 1 / Provide stable power = 0 / Utilize cores always = 1 / Time Stability = Stable / Time Performance Index = Optimal / SFS 0.90MB Max 120MB / Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect = on / Start Playback during conversion = off / Do not start playback at all = off / Copy to XX-drive by standard = on / Always clear Proxy before Playback = on / Stop Remaining Desktop Services = on / Stop Desktop Services = on / Stop Remaining Services = on / Stop WASAPI Services = on / Stop W10 Services = off / Keep LAN Services = on / Persist = off / Use Remote Desktop = on/ Arc Predict / Minimize OS = on / Peak Extend = off / Unattended

Audio Chain
Stealth MachII PC >> Lush^2 USB 1.1m >> NOS1a G3 B75, Driver v1.0.4 (4ms) >> Blaxius^2 >> 10Y DHT Preamp >> 6 way active horn speakers (Single Ended Triodes)
PeterSt
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« Reply #109 on: July 07, 2014, 11:43:22 am »

Hey Anthony,

Arc Prediction (without Custom) in 1.186-i is just the ever old one.

Thanks,
Peter
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W10-14393.0 - July 17, 2021 (2.11)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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« Reply #110 on: July 07, 2014, 03:52:40 pm »


Hi Peter,
this/yours is a very good description of the (Beta) “Custom filter”, which is the best with new details “raised” from digital music ever.

Made some additional comparisions between “Custom” & 16xAP, and raised my listening volume from -33 dB to -28,5 dB.

The only thing I’m missing is ambience. ( http://www.stereophile.com/content/sounds-audio-glossary-glossary )

A good sample is the CD “Naoko Live” from Naoko Terai. (3rd track “Black Market”)
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Naoko-Live-Terai/dp/B00005J4AO/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&qid=1404737519&sr=8-7&keywords=naoko+terai

With the filter “Custom” I’m sitting on the stage and with 16xAP the seat is appr. 25m away.

Joachim
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« Reply #111 on: July 07, 2014, 07:40:54 pm »

And you like the third row of course. Happy
(joking !)
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For the Stealth III LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - July 17, 2021 (2.11)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
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« Reply #112 on: July 07, 2014, 08:36:40 pm »

And you like the third row of course. Happy
(joking !)

NO, in that row a neck stiffness ................. .

Since most concerts are amplified today the best distance for a good listening position in concert halls is around 20m away.

At present I'm going up the ladder and stranded at 16xAP after a couple of weeks again (due to the rev. a).
Since the Ron Carter concert my priority for listening is ambience. (we do have to live with compromises)

Joachim
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« Reply #113 on: July 08, 2014, 08:32:46 am »

Quote
A good sample is the CD “Naoko Live” from Naoko Terai. (3rd track “Black Market”)
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Naoko-Live-Terai/dp/B00005J4AO/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&qid=1404737519&sr=8-7&keywords=naoko+terai

Quote
Since most concerts are amplified today the best distance for a good listening position in concert halls is around 20m away.

Some times my father had to play with microphone (see link in quote) and he hated it. He was also responsible (or made himself that) for the acoustics in the new concert hall back at the time. It just couldn't combine (as he told his 11 year old).

I will try to get that album and try to see wat you mean ...

(maybe I do this only to see whether we can talk about such subjects and whether it is possible to create filters which work out the same for everyone regarding such (ambiance) subjects)

Regards,
Peter
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For the Stealth III LPS PC :
W10-14393.0 - July 17, 2021 (2.11)
XXHighEnd Mach III Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon Scalable 14/28 core with Hyperthreading On (set to 14/28 cores in BIOS and set to 10/20 cores via Boot Menu) @~660MHz, 48GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/0/0/*1*/ Q1Factor = *4* / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = *10ms* / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *10.13*  (max 10.13) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *62* / Nervous Rate = *1* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / Custom Filtering *Low* (16x) / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush^3
A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere.

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« Reply #114 on: July 08, 2014, 10:01:11 am »


I will compare tomorrow with 1.186-d and original AP that I was running before my holiday, but 1.186-i does sound very nice.  


Hi Peter,

I am going to need to spend some more time listening to the Custom Filter to get a good handle on it.  It definitely sounds "warmer" and I do enjoy the resolution of steel strings that it has enhanced but I just wonder if some things sounds a little bit "the same" i.e. not enought variation betwwen the same instrument on different albums.  Not sure at the stage.  All was going well until I put of a couple of "warmer" sounding albums and I was not so convinced.

Anyway, I will listen for another week or so and then switch back to standard AP and report back.

Cheers,

Anthony
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« Reply #115 on: July 08, 2014, 10:36:20 am »

Thank you Anthony.

Things sounding the same is never a good thing (as you know from me / my thinking) so I sure would keep the focus on that for now (and I myself will try too).

Do notice though that it is not necessarily easy to judge this for real merits and that it really depends on the instrument;
Think about my example of a very low frequency sine really sounds the same everywhere because it is just that sine, and no matter from what album (hard to say "instrument") it has to sound the same when sufficiently undistorted. To a certain extent this is the same with higher frequencies; the more they tend towards sines the more the same they will sound.

Try to grasp that all the new filter actually does is making the higher frequencies less subject to distortion without added ringing. The other way around : when the higher frequencies are/become *more* subject to distortion, the resulting "tone" from it is very complex with a multitude of variations which can almost be called random. This is not about the wave form itself but what it produces for by-products.
In the end you might be talking about my own experience as written out yesterday, about the cymbals being "over". But not sure at all, so see upcoming post ...
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« Reply #116 on: July 08, 2014, 11:07:54 am »


I am almost sure that I talked about it before, but I think the first time I may have scratched (not posted) because it seemed to wild at the time (maybe one month ago). After that I wrote somewhere that the music reproduction became a sort of reference for the drum kit I listen to every day (son practicing). A really upside down thing ...

This will be a similar text to the one I never posted (at least I think I didn't) :

Whether the new filter or whether the combination with the NOS1a, things like cymbals got louder again; I talked about this yesterday.
Louder does not mean more square and tiring. I mean, that can be done too (including over 10 seconds sounding cymbals) but this is also (too) square and no good. Interesting, but tiring.
So what I talk about now is that actually a sort of opposite - a more square cymbal turns into a more higher pitched white. It becomes hash like when you first envision 6dB louder or so. This is how I name it to be "over". It gets too profound and the "white" sound is the same once the hits are louder. Now, I can try to find a technical explanation for it (logically a too low resolution) but my post here will tell something quite else ...

I now have the same with the live drum kit.
Btw frontmost logical explanation to *that* : my ears and all. But let's skip this for now.

So each day over here we also listen to my son's practicing. Not explicitly, but he's on the first floor above the music room - actually to the side of it. Hard to explain, but the room where the practicing occurs separates from the music room by a small glass wall (still this is two different levels for floor). Otherwise no doors are in that practicing room except for the entry door down stairs. All I'm saying is : I can outplay the guy only with well over 90dBSPL playback or better put : this usually doesn't happen so right through the music plays he.
I don't care since his practicing doesn't take ages per day anyway.

Meanwhile it allows me to unconsciously compare. So each single day I have been annoyed how far off the music reproduction still is from the real thing.
And since the NOS1a plus new filter (this happened about the same time for me) this annoyance has suddenly vanished. Also : it is not all so difficult any more to find drumming examples of which I now say "this is not so far from reality at all". And of course people will remember my self recording "complaints" about how only that recording was reall and all else a universe off.
Don't ask me how it can work (in combination) but the both - self recording and normal albums - are now much more closer (remember, the live recording was already totally real).

This is a very long lead-in to my observation that what I hear from the reproduced cymbals when smashed harder, sounds the same from the live drum kit when smashed harder. And what I hardly dare to write : the live rum kit annoys more.

So if now people can think of what is really happening ... please tell me.

But like I said it the other time : somehow the reproduction is starting to be a reference for live. Or already is that.

The drum kit is in an unconditioned room. All "hard". Even glass ceilings. It now has to be so that cymbals reflect everywhere and the sound of them becomes a mess. A hash. White hash. Notice that I am not writing this because I named the reproduction like that in my previous post. It is really what I think when I hear the drum kit, and now in aftermath I see that through the speakers I actually hear the same. Both are equally bad.
But the music room is not conditioned either ...

Anthony, remember us talking about that Klipsch drumming recording and how the cymbals saturate in there (towards the end) ? That. But now in real live.
But for heaven's sake, why couldn't I hear this before ?

I will finish with my ever so much given example of NOT being bothered by cymbal sound through speakers when the attack of them is lacking, UNTIL you only *one time* heard it throug the speakers. After that you'll have brain damage when there's no attack again (but cymbal sounding). This, while you sure know the sound of live cymbals.
This too I can't explain.
So something is happening in our brains which makes things relative to whatever we are used to and won't be better anyway so no problem. And now the last one :

So my music room is not conditioned either. Still the recording rooms will be and now it can theoretically happen that a recording sounds better than live.
Next thing is that I judge the live cymbal as worse than the reproduction.
This really is so and no way that I like to think the impossible (those who say that live sounds worse than recorded should be banned from all audio forums). Still I do.
So is this a sort of measure that I'm finally there ? Of course I like to think *that* but I promised myself 8 years ago that I would never ever think that any more (while back then I did).

wackowackowackowackowacko
Peter


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« Reply #117 on: July 08, 2014, 01:07:21 pm »

Interesting, I had two folks from the Philadelphia Area Audio Society in my listening room the other night and they both preferred the sound of standard AP via 186a verses the custom filter in 186i. They felt that the custom filter sounded too rolled off in the HF. Not sure I agree with their assessment.

Another thing, maybe its my imagination, but standard AP sounds different to me in 186a than in 186i. Seems like there is an active filter in 186i when AP is ticked instead of Custom, when plying at 8x oversampling.
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« Reply #118 on: July 08, 2014, 01:27:43 pm »

Quote
A good sample is the CD “Naoko Live” from Naoko Terai. (3rd track “Black Market”)
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Naoko-Live-Terai/dp/B00005J4AO/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&qid=1404737519&sr=8-7&keywords=naoko+terai


(maybe I do this only to see whether we can talk about such subjects and whether it is possible to create filters which work out the same for everyone regarding such (ambiance) subjects)

Regards,
Peter


Hi Peter,

a description with other impressions, but the same meaning.

The acoustic bass on the Brian Bromberg CD sounds with "Custom" very detailed, unbelievable, but the sound comes from a "deadened" ( evacuated) room with less reverberation and deacay of the instrument.

The "resin" sound of the violin on the Naoko Terai CD is less accentuated.

If you have one CD with an acoustic bass solo and another with a violin you should hear the difference.

The Naoko Terai CD is a terrific funky jazz album, same tracks are good to dance. (Market Place (a Weather Report tune) + Rio Funk)

Joachim
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« Reply #119 on: July 08, 2014, 01:33:10 pm »

Interesting, I had two folks from the Philadelphia Area Audio

Another thing, maybe its my imagination, but standard AP sounds different to me in 186a than in 186i. Seems like there is an active filter in 186i when AP is ticked instead of Custom, when plying at 8x oversampling.

Hi Brian,

I  received a rev. "e" with the upgrage to the NOS1a and I have "acoustic hallucinations" that this revision is superoir to "i". Strange, because the 16xAP filter has not been changed.
So, it's time for a Wodka with Coke and ice (less headaches)

Joachim
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