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Author Topic: Cables with BNC Connectors/Adapters Are Generating A Superoir SQ  (Read 182990 times)
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manisandher
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« Reply #315 on: October 22, 2014, 07:47:12 am »

Since Mani and Paul are on "Cloud 9" with Peters Blaxius BNC cable I have ordered a pair for a comparison.

Now, of course, I 'm hoping to hear your impression of the "silver coated copper" versus the Blaxius, though based on Peter, Paul and Mani's impressions, I'm pretty sure I know what it will be.

Hi Joachim, hi Brian. For my part, I'd say I'm on Cloud 9 about my '75B' NOS1a, and not the Blaxius cables... not yet, at least.

You see, I was seriously impressed with my RG223 H+S cables - I mean, simply the best cables I'd ever heard, 'by a country mile'. Since receiving the 75B, I've only used it with the Blaxius cables because of the 75B's 75 Ohm output (the Blaxius are 75 Ohms, the H+S 50 Ohms).

BUT... when crawling under my floorboards installing the Blaxius cables, I left the RG223 H+S cables in place. My intention was to compare them with the Blaxius cables once the latter (and the 75B) had had a few days to settle down. But I may bring the comparison forward. But I can guess right now that the H+S will sound brighter and more lively, and the Blaxius smoother and more laid back. But we'll see...

Mani.
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« Reply #316 on: October 22, 2014, 08:38:53 am »


The only slightly odd thing is the sound sitting in the "sweet spot" between the speakers - there are some phase like effects just moving the head slightly. I just wonder if it is necessary to get the speakers exactly positioned now to get best effects - I will get the lasers out and see how accurately I can set them up. But hey that is a trivial observation this sound quality is simply stunning.

Cheers
Paul

Hi Paul,

since I'm using a laptop (battery removed) the "sweet spot listening position" is not mandatory anymore/again and I'm sitting in my prefered "off axis" sofa, AND the SQ is much better than with my PC. It is another/higher league.

Joachim

I never told it I think, but there's nothing of the kind going on with the "Blaxius". The other ones Yes. In fact I found it quite annoying this "beaming". So I mostly listen from the kitchen (as you know, always grabbing beers) and kitchen-work comes along with walking in there. So this was always "catching the beam" when walking through the middle of the speaker path so to speak. For me this was even more annoying because it always put my attention to the necessity to listen from the mid-point hence SQ would be worse outside of that. So I was actually more standing in that middle and listening than grabbing beers. Not good.

Remember Paul, you need quite some toeing out in the first place and regarding your speaker distance and listening distance this won't be so easy I think. So on-axis listening is not allowed (says personal me).

Peter
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« Reply #317 on: October 22, 2014, 08:52:40 am »

•   the whole sound-stage is now placed well behind the speakers
•­   cymbals generally waaay back in room (but still totally crystal clear)
­•   voices 1-2m behind speakers

Mani, can you help us here ...

I completely forgot to respond to this, but when I read it I right way thought "is Mani judging this as positive or what ?".
So are you ?

I mean, I don't think I would. And your "laid back" from your last post makes me think about that again.

Let's try to focus on this 1-2m behind the speakers. I don't think you even have this space behind the speakers, so what's up ?
You might respond with a "huh ?" but in that case I "claim" that no sound is going to spring from any position outside the room's walls, unless DSP is in order. However, strange reflections may incur for it ? I am not sure.

Otherwise I myself said something about "laid back but not" in this topic somewhere, and then meaning something like "you actually can't tell". I forgot. I now don't recognize it any more (while listening not explicitly for this and "looking for it" I did not (just forgot about it). So maybe I got used to it - I don't know.

Something else is that "something might be going on" in a very different area, which I maybe wanted to start talking about today, but anyway can be related to your perception. So I now mentioned it in brief ahead of another post to come (but maybe not today).

Regards,
Peter

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« Reply #318 on: October 22, 2014, 11:02:12 am »

Hey Peter, just a very quick reply as I need to leave in the next 10 mins or so...

... but when I read it I right way thought "is Mani judging this as positive or what ?".
So are you ?

Yes, actually. One of my criticisms of my old Swing horns and (to a much lesser extent) my current Orelo horns has been that there seems a slight disconnect between the horn and the bass. The MF/HF seem to be pushed forward well into the room, and the LF much further back. But right now, everything seems 'together'.

Let's try to focus on this 1-2m behind the speakers. I don't think you even have this space behind the speakers, so what's up ?

You're right, my speakers are (necessarily) quite close to the rear wall. But my feeling is that there's so much 'real' detail now that the soundstage seems to have deepened. Cymbals especially seem to come from way back.

But in case it's important, my initial thoughts were based on the F-M curves totally flat (i.e. 1, 1, 3; all green). I've since switched to H=2 (i.e. 1, 1, 2). This has re-balanced the sound somewhat and has brought the MF/HF slightly forward.

All in all, I think it's just a matter of frequency balance in my case. Remember, my bass gain is set to -25.0dB. I've tried decreasing the gain to -25.5dB (and all settings in between), but feel that the sound becomes overly thin as a result (even with a 0.1dB change!).

Gotta go, but happy to share more later...

Mani.



[/quote]
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XXHighEnd: 2.10 / Minimize OS / Engine#4 Adaptive / DB=4096 / *trying*: Q1=30 / xQ1=40 / Q3,4,5=1 / SFS=5.19 / XTweaks = 52, 10, 0, 0, 1 / Straight Contiguous / Clock Resolution = 15ms / Scheme 3-5 (low/realtime) / 16x Arc Prediction / Unattended
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« Reply #319 on: October 22, 2014, 11:47:01 am »

OK, all understood.
Thank you Mani.
Peter
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« Reply #320 on: October 22, 2014, 02:22:18 pm »

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In fact I found it quite annoying this "beaming". So I mostly listen from the kitchen

I used to get this with the previous interconnect but not quite so marked (more detail now!) anyway as you say I probably need to straighten the speakers somewhat but that brings other problems ..............

anyway it is not a significant problem but I will try is more beer!! that may help.

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« Reply #321 on: October 22, 2014, 08:30:57 pm »


The only slightly odd thing is the sound sitting in the "sweet spot" between the speakers - there are some phase like effects just moving the head slightly. I just wonder if it is necessary to get the speakers exactly positioned now to get best effects - I will get the lasers out and see how accurately I can set them up. But hey that is a trivial observation this sound quality is simply stunning.

Cheers
Paul

Hi,

some loudspeaker manuf. (Ascendo with their System M5-S) are adjusting the position of their speakers very accurate in dependence to the  "sweet spot" of the listening position.
They are measurering the distance from the left speaker plane  to the left ear, and from the right speaker to the ................ .

The sweet spot is (with the adjusted placement of the speakers) the only perfect listening position in that room. The signal from the left speaker is a "mirror image" of the signal from the right speaker at that place (with a pink noise signal).
 At other positions we hear different "signals" due to other/different running times to our ears.

The possible “off axis“ listening position is not the best place for serious listening sessions, but might be a good location for „easy listening“ during „studies“ on an iPad or in books, newspapers.

And, as Peter wrote, when we are listening to very loud music (from the room) outside on a veranda with the present configuration, the sound seems to be LIVE.

Joachim
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« Reply #322 on: October 22, 2014, 08:55:22 pm »

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They are measurering the distance from the left speaker plane  to the left ear, and from the right speaker to the ................

Hi Joachim - good point and sounds great, that is what I had in mind to do with my "laser" but the problem in my room is the reflected sounds from the side walls are only 4-8ms behind the main incident sound. And what is worse is that it is different left / right. That means my poor brain is totally confused (not unusual that!) as to what it is listening to. So maybe when I go to the trouble of getting the speakers perfectly lined up (and get a head brace to keep my head in the perfect position ha ha) I need to treat the room for reflections - I will see how much enthusiasm I can muster.

Cheers

Paul
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« Reply #323 on: October 23, 2014, 02:39:16 pm »


Hi Joachim, hi Brian. For my part, I'd say I'm on Cloud 9 about my '75B' NOS1a, and not the Blaxius cables... not yet, at least.

You see, I was seriously impressed with my RG223 H+S cables - I mean, simply the best cables I'd ever heard, 'by a country mile'. Since receiving the 75B, I've only used it with the Blaxius cables because of the 75B's 75 Ohm output (the Blaxius are 75 Ohms, the H+S 50 Ohms).

BUT... when crawling under my floorboards installing the Blaxius cables, I left the RG223 H+S cables in place. My intention was to compare them with the Blaxius cables once the latter (and the 75B) had had a few days to settle down. But I may bring the comparison forward. But I can guess right now that the H+S will sound brighter and more lively, and the Blaxius smoother and more laid back. But we'll see...

Mani.

Thanks Mani. I assume the center conductor of your H & S cable is the solid silver-coated copper version. Given the change in the NOS1a-75b version of the NOS1, would it be possible for you to compare your H & S cable using your "standard" NOS1a DAC to your Blaxius cable using the 75b version of the NOS1a? Hope that's not too much trouble!

Brian
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« Reply #324 on: October 23, 2014, 03:51:01 pm »

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Hope that's not too much trouble!

scratchingscratchingscratching
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XXHighEnd Mach II Stealth LPS PC -> Xeon E5 2640v4 with Hyperthreading On (20 cores) @~720MHz, 32GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 14393.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 30/-/1/1/1/ Q1Factor = 40 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 15ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = *5.19*  (max 120) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / Stop Desktop, Remaining, WASAPI and W10 services / Use Remote Desktop / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD Off (!) / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *52* (*43 ??*) / Nervous Rate = *10* / Cool when Idle = n.a / Provide Stable Power = 0 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = Optimal / Time Stability = Stable / *Arc Prediction Filtering (16x)* / Always Clear Proxy before Playback = On -> USB3 from MoBo -> Lush USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (*16ms*) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).

For a general PC :
W10-10586.0 - May 2016 (2.05+)
*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10  (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
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« Reply #325 on: October 23, 2014, 04:28:46 pm »

... would it be possible for you to compare your H & S cable using your "standard" NOS1a DAC to your Blaxius cable using the 75b version of the NOS1a? Hope that's not too much trouble!

Quote
Hope that's not too much trouble!

scratchingscratchingscratching

Haha...

Well, I had the NOS1a/H+S hooked up to the Orelos for a few weeks before the 75B/Blaxius came back and am quite familiar with the sound. The only difference now would be the BNC connectors on the Orelos. Assuming the BNC connectors in the Orelos aren't making a massive difference, I can already give you a take on the difference in sound between the two setups: it's as I described it earlier in this thread. Let me know if you need any more details though.

What I really need to do is compare the H+S and Blaxius cables, both using the 75B. This might give some insights into whether Peter's 'reflections' hypothesis is true or not.

Mani.

Edit: Yes, my H+S cables are the 'expensive' solid silver-coated copper version; model K_03252D.

 
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XXHighEnd: 2.10 / Minimize OS / Engine#4 Adaptive / DB=4096 / *trying*: Q1=30 / xQ1=40 / Q3,4,5=1 / SFS=5.19 / XTweaks = 52, 10, 0, 0, 1 / Straight Contiguous / Clock Resolution = 15ms / Scheme 3-5 (low/realtime) / 16x Arc Prediction / Unattended
Main System: USB3 port -> Lush -> Phisolator -> Phasure NOS1a B75 G3 -> First Watt F5-cloned mono amps -> Tune Audio Anima horn speakers
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« Reply #326 on: October 23, 2014, 05:42:46 pm »

Okay, thanks guys. Sorry if I'm being a PITA!
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« Reply #327 on: October 26, 2014, 06:38:29 pm »

But I can guess right now that the H+S will sound brighter and more lively, and the Blaxius smoother and more laid back. But we'll see...

What I really need to do is compare the H+S and Blaxius cables, both using the 75B. This might give some insights into whether Peter's 'reflections' hypothesis is true or not.

I compared my H+S cables to the Blaxius cables using my 75B, and...

Well, as I expected, the H+S cables do indeed sound a little brighter. But I'm not sure this is down to extra or extended HF. Rather, I think it's because of less LF (especially ultra-LF) energy. They also seem to give instruments and voices a slight edge, which makes them appear sharper and more focused. Overall, I prefer the Blaxius cables. They have that magic quality of smoothness along with detail... just like real life. Is this down to fewer cable reflections? Maybe.

But I don't want to give the impression that I think I'm at the end of my 'hifi journey'. I'm not. It's obvious to me that although my system is now making some beautiful noises it wouldn't fool anyone into thinking it's the real thing. I think I've still got some more work to do on the electrics, the PC, and of course the bloody USB cable issue that seems to be haunting us still. But I'm really happy with the Orelo speakers and the 75B... and totally stoked that I can use 10m Blaxius interconnects (without any loss in quality), keeping my listening room free from the usual hifi clutter.

So a massive thanks to Joachim for broaching this subject in the first place, and for Peter for taking things forward to their natural conclusion.

Mani.
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Audio PC: Phasure Mach II *with clock upgrade* / Win 14393.0 on RAM-OS / controlled by RDC, no GPU card installed / connected directly to music server
XXHighEnd: 2.10 / Minimize OS / Engine#4 Adaptive / DB=4096 / *trying*: Q1=30 / xQ1=40 / Q3,4,5=1 / SFS=5.19 / XTweaks = 52, 10, 0, 0, 1 / Straight Contiguous / Clock Resolution = 15ms / Scheme 3-5 (low/realtime) / 16x Arc Prediction / Unattended
Main System: USB3 port -> Lush -> Phisolator -> Phasure NOS1a B75 G3 -> First Watt F5-cloned mono amps -> Tune Audio Anima horn speakers
Office System: Lush -> Phisolator -> Phasure NOS1a G3 -> BD-Design BD30-SPR mono amps -> Tune Audio Marvel speakers
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« Reply #328 on: October 27, 2014, 11:46:53 am »

Thanks Mani for taking the time to do this and for giving us your impressions.
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« Reply #329 on: October 29, 2014, 11:55:32 am »

http://www.phasure.com/index.php?topic=3038.msg32807#msg32807

[/quote]

Hello Joachim

Not sure but why are you not using XLR Cables?
Is there any thread here explaining why BNC would be superior to even XLR? = NO

Speaking of XLR and Cables.... maybe people do not used them with their Phasure setup here not often.

Regards, Michael
[/quote]

Hi Michael,

there was a discussion in the German audio press about the preference of  XLR or RCA connections  appr. 5 to 10 years ago and the opinion was a "draw" between both.

I made a comparison between a XLR Nordost SPM and a RCA Nordost Valkyria and the difference was insignificant to my ears at that time and so I stuck to cables with RCA connectors.

Joachim
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